Set up normal. Set up normal. Yes, sir. >> Put the seat belt on you. >> Yes, sir. >> Head back. >> I'm in my vehicle. I'm not parked. >> Your vehicle's not even >> But I'm I'm on I'm at I'm at my vehicle. I haven't left my vehicle yet. >> Yes, but he wouldn't have known that until he pulled me over after an unreasonable stop. But that is but okay. Police officers are trusted with incredible authority, but what happens when that authority is pushed beyond its limits? In today's cases, you'll see encounters that leave you wondering whether some officers believe they're above the very laws they swore to enforce. The people involved refuse to stay silent, and what unfolds next turns each confrontation into something far bigger than anyone expected. Let's get started. Come on, man. What started as nothing more than a flat tire quickly turned into one of the strangest police encounters you'll ever see. Sylvester Thompson and his girlfriend Heather were stranded on the side of the road in the middle of the night when officer Hunter Talk decided they deserved his attention. Within minutes, a man who hadn't been accused of any crime was running through a field while multiple officers chased him. But that was only the beginning of a story that would keep getting harder to explain. >> Yeah. trying to step out on a stranded motorist and I got one running on me westbound or northbound through Ammo Bank on MG bank on 517 via a black male white t-shirt tant sheriff's office any other but people responding there's a white or silver in SUV on 517 on channel 2. Channel 2 is close to emergency traffic. A deputy reported a man running from the scene, quickly describing Sylvester's clothing while other units started responding. Here's the thing. Running might make an officer curious, but curiosity isn't the legal standard for chasing someone. The Fourth Amendment still required reasonable suspicion of a crime, not simply a person who decided to leave. Yet, the search was already growing into something much bigger than a stranded motorist. Heat. Heat. Sheriff's Office 401. I left outside of I'm in the hotel parking lot across the street. >> 11 Hotel. >> Uh, give me a second. >> Several minutes later, the search kept dragging on as officers spread through the area looking for Sylvester. They checked around a nearby hotel and searched the surrounding property as if they were tracking a dangerous fugitive rather than someone who had run after seeing a patrol car turn around. Makes you wonder how many tax dollars disappear during searches that begin without anybody first establishing whether a crime had actually happened. Still, the frustration among the officers was only starting to show. Lone star, >> huh? >> You said that way >> in the field. >> Okay. >> And then I kept hearing stuff crash. >> You want to ride back? >> No, I'm good. I'm going to keep looking through that damn field. >> So, he cut through my car's at Yeah. cut through that field. I lost him in that field, but then I heard something crack in that building over there, and I didn't want to clear that whole building by myself cuz this got a little bitty ass wall. My biggest ass ain't f through the little man. >> This way through this field. He's either in that field or he kept coming out cuz that's all fenced off right there. >> But uh I'm going to go clear the rest of that building real quick. By this point, officer Hunter admitted he had lost Sylvester somewhere in a field and started talking through possible hiding spots with another officer. He even joked that he didn't want to clear a part of a building alone because it was too small for him to move through comfortably. Funny how officer safety suddenly becomes the high-risisk priority. Apparently, that same careful thinking wasn't necessary before launching the entire pursuit. Just a few minutes later, another conversation would make the legal issues even harder to ignore. Ready? Sheriff's Office. >> Give me one second. I'm clearing a building. >> 408. >> All right. Dickinson's advising of a burglary on progress possibly related. Oh, where >> subject ran south from that residence? Black male, white shirt, white pants. >> Okay, that's him. >> 403 Sawyer Going Court. >> Where the hell was that? >> Yeah. Meanwhile, Officer Hunter briefly entered a small building to clear it before more radio traffic interrupted the search. Another report suggested a possible burglary nearby involving someone matching Sylvester's description, prompting officers to connect unrelated events almost immediately. Did they actually have evidence linking him to the report, or did they simply hear the words blackmail and decide the case was solved? That assumption would soon collide with someone who had actually witnessed how this all began. >> I have someone on the phone right now. >> Why did he run from me? >> He's running from me. He went running from you. >> I busted around. He took off running. >> No, he we were right there. He was pissed off. >> I know exactly where y'all were. I turned around because of this. >> He's He's just has to see the police and then just all of a sudden run >> because y'all [ __ ] with him all the time. He's out on >> Well, now he's going to have a warrant >> for what? >> Evading. >> He evaded for what though? He evaded for what? He evaded me. That same thing. He took off running from me. He didn't even see you. >> Cool. Yes, he did. Ross, he didn't even see him. >> He took off running from me from right there and I pulled into the driveway right here. >> There's no evict. >> Obviously, this is >> that's hers. I I ran him. He's concerned. So, were they in the road? >> Yeah. In the middle of the road. >> So, I busted around. I could see them arguing with each other. And then as I bust around, I see both doors fly open, and he just tears off through this field, cuts up in there. So, I came up and threw my lights on real quick. That way, my camera would turn on. So, yeah. And he just kept running. I yelled, "Sheriff's office," and kept on running. She's acting like that. >> Come on, Deputy Touchs. Tell >> Not long afterward, Heather challenged Officer Hunter face to face and questioned why Sylvester was being treated like a criminal at all. Officer Hunter insisted Sylvester ran from him and claimed that alone justified an evading charge. But evading detention usually depends on whether the attempted detention was lawful in the first place. If officers didn't have reasonable suspicion before the chase began, the entire foundation started looking very shaky. The conversation was far from over. >> But I'm not arguing with you. He took my money from me, not from you. >> They saw me and he took those doors blew open. >> You said the vehicle took off too, right? >> I thought it did cuz it was over here. >> Go for it. >> Can we open channel 2? >> Yeah. Second officer is advising. He's running his backyard all the way back to me and pants and a white t-shirt. Black. >> Yeah, they're >> Yeah, that's going to be it. >> Well, open channel and go to Dickson's. >> Yeah, we can do that. >> Like, I don't see a point in doing a perimeter unless they're going to pursue him, too. And >> said he's coming back to 517. 11. You can open the channel. We'll go over to Dickson for this guy. >> Channel one direction. >> Eventually, officers caught up with Sylvester and placed him inside a patrol vehicle for transport to jail. That's where this case took its strangest turn. Something happened inside that patrol car, but the public never received the full story because the most important portion of the transport footage was muted and edited before it was released. Shortly afterward, Sylvester somehow got out of the moving patrol car and escaped onto the highway. Whatever happened inside that vehicle became one of the biggest unanswered questions in the entire case, man. A few moments later, the footage showed Sylvester jumping from the patrol car, even though he was still handcuffed. Officer Hunter deployed his taser again, yet Sylvester still managed to get away. Think about how desperate someone would have to feel before choosing a busy highway over staying inside a police vehicle. Whatever happened during that missing section clearly matters. >> You got anything on you? No, >> sir. Spread your feet. Spread your feet. >> Spread your feet open as wide as you can. Yes, sir. You should be good. >> All right, get in. >> Set up normal. >> Set up normal. Yes, sir. >> Put the seat belt on you. >> Yes, sir. >> Head back. Head back. Put your [ __ ] bleed on me. Stay in the car this time. This time the arrest looked very different. Sylvester fully cooperated as officers searched him, helped him into the patrol car, and even followed every instruction about sitting properly and fastening his belt. Funny how quickly someone supposedly dangerous transformed into someone answering every command without resistance. Guess the terrifying threat. suddenly disappeared once enough officers surrounded him. Still, one unnecessary remark from a deputy showed the previous escape hadn't left anyone's ego behind. Hey, not too good, huh? Wake up. Sit up straight. Sit up straight. Sit up straight. Sit up straight. Sit up straight. Sit up straight. Put this over your shoulder. There you go. And you quit falling over. Sit up straight. Kind of spit. right here. >> I got the other guy. >> Hey, look this way. We got EMS coming for you. All right. >> A little later, officers repeatedly ordered Sylvester to sit upright as they noticed he was slumping over inside the vehicle. They also told him medical personnel were on the way, suggesting they recognized he needed attention after everything that had happened. Yet, here's the thing. If someone is in enough pain that they can barely sit upright, maybe it's worth asking whether the force leading up to that moment was truly necessary. Yet that uncomfortable question never seemed to concern anyone wearing a bag. >> We're going to take some vitals and stuff on you. Okay. >> Is that all right? >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. >> Hey, we can't take the P off. He's pretty. >> I'm not trying. >> Okay. Just letting y'all know. Is that all over again? When EMS finally arrived, the focus shifted to Sylvester's condition, but Officer Hunter Talk still found time to warn the medics that he was violent. That's an interesting description for someone sitting handcuffed in the back of patrol car waiting to be examined. Did anyone stop to ask whether those injuries matched the level of force that had been used? Or was labeling him dangerous simply the easiest way to justify everything that came before? Either way, the story was heading toward one final confrontation. probably >> [ __ ] >> Oh my god. >> Yard. >> Yeah. >> Please, bro. Can you at least open that cuff a little bit? Please. >> Not right now. >> I'm begging you. I can't do nothing, bro. I can't even help you or nothing, >> bro. You put this on yourself, bro. Just loosen it a little bit. I'm not going to run >> like you did before. >> Oh my god. Just give us a second, man. Much later, Sylvester begged officers to loosen his handcuffs because they were causing him serious pain. The response was exactly what you'd expect. He was reminded that he had escaped before, so his discomfort wasn't anyone else's problem, but handcuffs are meant to secure someone up, punish them, right? Once a suspect is fully restrained, unnecessary pain serves no legitimate law enforcement purpose. Yet, the officers never seemed interested in making that distinction. >> Big dog, come out. >> Sit up. We're going to move you to a vehicle with bars so you don't feel tempted to run. >> Okay. >> Okay. enough. >> There you go. >> [ __ ] >> Come on. >> Face that way. >> Face that way. >> In the end, the case reportedly took a surprising turn. Most of the original charges against Sylvester were dropped while the escaping charge remained because he accepted a plea agreement and was incarcerated for leaving the patrol car during transport. Meanwhile, the officers reportedly stayed on the job as questions about the detention, the use of force, and muted footage. and missing audio continued to linger. Sylvester's family also reportedly pursued legal action over the force used during the arrest, meaning the civil side of this story. We still have plenty left to reveal. And if you think these officers went too far, just wait until you see this next kid. For some people, homelessness seemed to be treated like a crime all by itself. And that's exactly what this encounter looked like when an officer approached two homeless men sitting on a public sidewalk while a citizen stepped into question why they were being bothered in the first place. What started as a simple conversation quickly turned into a debate over constitutional rights. >> I'm not allowed on that side, actually. >> Hey, what's up? >> So >> So these guys are They're not allowed to be in public. >> No, they're allowed to be in public there. But you see what they're doing right now? >> People complained right now. Yeah, it doesn't look like anybody's blocking the sidewalk. >> Don't talk. Don't move. >> You have no right. You have no need to talk to his ass. He's in charge of us. >> Won't move. >> He in charge of us, >> baby. Won't move. Let's move. Come on. >> You guys badge numbers. >> Yeah, my badge number is 550. I Alex, we've had better relations the last couple times we spoke. I don't know why you're upset. We've talked about this. >> It's It's all the mess and everything that's left on the sidewalk. Okay. >> But what I'm saying I'm saying is >> right from the start, the officer insisted the homeless men were creating a problem simply by sitting on the sidewalk. Even though nothing suggested anyone couldn't get around them. Here's the funny part. When someone asked why they were even being contacted, the answer kept changing from complaints to messes to simply driving by. Makes you wonder whether the officers were investigating an actual violation or just hoping one would appear if they talked long enough. >> If I would have complained. So, meaning you're not here on Do you want me to show you the orders? >> You're not here on a call. You're here on a person. >> I'm here because we're driving by. >> Yeah. >> That's what we do. >> Which means you keep driving by. >> No, because that's not >> We're not doing anything [ __ ] legal. All of this [ __ ] week. Two. >> You're blocking the sidewalk. >> Yeah. And don't be quiet. You weren't cold there. You're just scaring a personal vendetta. >> It's not a personal vendetta. >> It's [ __ ] seen on you. Don't [ __ ] lie to me. >> How many times have I >> Don't lie a liar. Don't talk to my wife, homeboy. >> Don't talk to my wife without my permission. >> So So they're not allowed to be in public. Is that what he's saying? >> That's not what I said, sir. Sir, what I said was that he's on a public sidewalk and he's obstructing it. Can you You could videotape and see how much they're occupying the sidewalk. >> You know whose building these in front of? >> No, I don't. Doesn't really matter cuz that's private property. >> It's your governor's building. >> It doesn't matter. >> Your governor's broken down sit stack >> of a building that nobody takes care of. >> There's nobody to call and complain here. >> There's nobody to call and complain on this block. Why would you bother? >> You guys been requesting video. It's It's This is being videotaped the whole time. >> There's There's nobody. This block is empty. As the conversation continued, the focus shifted toward whether homeless people even had the right to remain where they were. The officer talked about blocking a sidewalk while the man filming pointed out that nobody had actually complained. That's an important distinction because a police authority doesn't magically expand whenever someone looks poor. If public sidewalks suddenly became off limits based on appearances alone, we're all one bad day away from becoming suspicious. >> I don't know, man. It seems like they should have the right to be on the sidewalk. >> Yeah, but what about what about the the homeless Bill of Rights? >> What about it? Show it to me. I don't even >> I'll give it to you. I'll get it right now. >> I'll get it for you right now. The homeless bill of rights. Oh, >> I assume you have a handicap placer. Yeah. >> Do you have a handicap placer? >> Is it displayed? >> It's in a mess in there. >> Is it displayed? >> I I wasn't parking. Don't let me >> Is your car parked? >> No, my car wasn't I was stopped here to talk to >> give you a ticket, but you want to question me on my job. You're illegally parked right now. >> I wasn't parking. I was stopping to help you guys when you interrupted. Sir, >> is it registered in the church? >> Yeah, you can go check it. >> Okay, I will. >> There is the Bill of Rights that you wanted to fill though. Here we go. >> I'm going to I'm going to It's very dirty. I don't want to touch that. >> Well, there's the race. >> Do you have >> They had to rewrite this for you. >> Sir, it's okay. Do you have a handicap placard that drops in our big ass taxes? That's why I said I'm in my vehicle. I'm not parked. >> Your vehicle is not even running. >> But I'm I'm on I'm at >> I'm at my vehicle. I haven't left my vehicle yet. >> You are parked. You were walking and videotaping the whole time. You were >> Yeah. Standing at my vehicle. >> You were not in your vehicle. You were still at my vehicle. Before long, the discussion turned into an argument about the homeless Bill of Rights, something the officer didn't quite seem familiar with at all. Rather than considering whether those protections applied here, he quickly shifted his attention toward the cameraman's vehicle. Funny how fast subject changed once legal questions entered the conversation. >> You want to give me a ticket? Write me a ticket, sir. Please write me the ticket. My job when you're illegal. >> Please write me the ticket. Please write me the ticket. >> I don't even want >> Please write me the ticket. But I I do want to know why. Why >> I want to know why you I don't have rights. >> Do you have your ID on you? >> I don't. >> You don't have an ID? >> Okay. All right. So, do you have a license? >> All right. Uh, am I being detained? >> Do you have a license? >> Am I being detained? >> Well, is your car parked there? >> No. >> All right. So, I'll be on my way then, right? >> I'm sorry. No, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Did I tell you to leave at this point? >> I asked if I was being detained >> right now because you're telling me you don't have a license and now you're going to get >> Am I being detained? >> Do you have a license? >> Am I being detained? >> Do you have a license? >> What's this? What crime do you suspect me of, sir? Facebook. >> Well, in a minute. Driving without a license. >> You suspect me of driving without a license. >> Right now, Right now, you're parked in a handicap parking spot with no handicap license. >> I wasn't parked until I pulled up. >> Is your vehicle off? >> I turned. >> Is your vehicle off to record you, sir? Yes. Your >> vehicle is off. You >> suddenly the cameraman became the center of the attention here instead of the original homeless men. The officer repeatedly insisted the vehicle was illegally parked while the cameraman calmly asked whether he was actually being detained. Here's the thing. That question, it's not some sort of clever trick. Officers are supposed to know exactly when a consensual conversation becomes an investigative detention. So why did such a simple question seem so difficult to answer? >> Outside of your car before I even got here. >> No, I was in my car when you pulled up and I turned on the camera in my car. >> I stopped. The only reason I got out of my car is cuz you're harassing them. >> No, that's not true. That's not true. You're not free to leave. Step out of the car. >> Okay. >> You are being detained. Step out of the car. >> The only reason is cuz you're harassing them. >> No. >> Because you want to question me on my No problem with them and now you're driving. No problem. I think Do you have your license? Do you have a license? >> What am I being suspected of? >> Do you have a license? >> What crime do you suspect of? >> Do you want to drive away? I pull you over and you're driving without a license. >> Okay, then do that. >> Okay. So, do you have a do you have a license? >> Do you suspect me of a crime, sir? >> Am I being suspected of a crime? >> Oh, that's okay. Move the car over and I just run this plate and see if this car registered. >> So, are you going to read it there? Right. say you're violating right now. >> I'm not violating anybody's right. They are on a city. >> This was what they wrote it. That's why they wrote this. >> Only after several rounds of questioning did the officer finally announce the cameraman was being detained. But even then, the explanation, it kept shifting. First, it was parking. Then, it became driving without a license, then circle back once again. And are we really supposed to believe reasonable suspicion works like a roulette wheel where officers keep spinning until something sounds convincing? >> That's why they wrote this. >> That's what they wrote this for. for them to be able to be and then we'll deal with them. >> All right, no problem. So So now you're doing this in retaliation. That's what you said, right? >> Those were your words. >> Handling you because >> you because you said that I you're retaliating. You said you're doing this in retaliation. >> Your officer clearly said he's doing this in retaliation. Sir, >> he said the only reason he's doing this cuz I bothered him. >> That's not what I said. My camera's been on this whole time. You can make up all your lies you want. Fine. Do you have your ID? >> Can I ask you? >> Am I suspected of a crime? >> I need your ID. I got to see if this if this is your vehicle. >> Am I suspected of a crime >> right now? Yes. You illegally parked. >> Okay. Give it a ticket and I'll leave. >> Okay. I got to see. If your car is not registered, I can't give you a ticket for it. I'd have to tow the vehicle. >> That's fine. >> Okay. I don't want to have to >> do what you have to do. Unless you suspect me of a crime, I'd like to be on my way, sir. >> Meanwhile, the cameraman reminded the officers that the entire encounter began after he questioned how they were treating the homeless men. One officer denied retaliating, yet another admitted the conversation changed because he had challenged them. Congratulations, we're back where we started. Still, the First Amendment does protect criticism of government officials for a reason. >> Do you suspect me of a crime? >> Is your car registered? >> Do you suspect me of a crime? >> Is your car >> Can I be on my way? >> Is your car >> Do you suspect me of a crime? >> Is your car registered? >> Are you extorting me for my identification store? >> Are you extorting me for my Are you telling me I cannot go free? And you don't suspect me of a crime and I can't go free unless I give you my ID. >> You don't suspect me of a crime that vehicle. I've asked you haven't done that. I've asked you to produce your registration. >> Can you stop screaming, please? >> No. I have to talk over you cuz you're talking to me like an idiot this whole time. So, explain something to me. Explain something to me. Do you have a registration? Do you have a license? I'm asking you for those two things. Do you have a >> Do you suspect me of a crime? >> What crime are you investigating? How about the >> What crime are you investigating? >> It still works. >> All right. Listen. >> What crime are you investigating? >> Well, we make first we're making >> Okay. So, I'm a good citizen. >> You're asking me a question. Answer it. Do you want me to answer your question or not? >> So, I'm a good citizen now. >> I don't know who you are cuz you haven't identified yourself. >> Well, you're treating me like a terrorist. >> I'm trying to answer your question. >> Tell people they can't sit on the floor in a [ __ ] America. nothing to do with you. You're just making my job difficult cuz you feel that you're entitled to do that. >> No, bro. This is This is the Bill of Rights right here in your hand. >> This is the Bill of Rights right here. They had to rewrite this in the [ __ ] >> At this point, frustration boiled over as the cameraman accused officers of treating ordinary people like criminals for defending homeless citizens. He even pointed back to the very law protecting their right to remain on the sidewalk. And the irony couldn't have been clearer. Officers spend years learning statues, yet a citizen standing beside them seemed far more prepared to explain the rights involved. >> State for you guys to understand this is a violation of your of their rights. >> Okay. They are on a public sidewalk >> and in [clears throat] America. They're in the freest country in the [ __ ] world and you're harassing them. >> Very good. Do you have a handicap placard? >> Are you detaining me? >> If you don't want to get a ticket for parking in a handicap spot, I would suggest that you move your vehicle. >> No problem. That's all it comes down to. >> Yeah, >> that's all it comes down to because I could issue you a ticket. >> Is it I don't know. >> Yes. >> Oh, you know, huh? >> I've seen you before. Yeah. >> I used to work at the courthouse. I've seen you come in there before. No big deal. I got no problem. >> So, would you like a card? >> Are you a nice guy? >> That's your opinion. I don't know. I can't answer that question. Well, you know the oath you took, right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Well, what are you doing right now, sir? It's >> my job. You're illegal. It's not your job. >> They shouldn't be sitting here making a mess. >> Yeah. >> There's no mess, dude. >> Dude, that's everything they own. They're sitting here. >> You also don't know how many interactions we've had with them when there's human feces and urine on the ground over here. You don't know that because you haven't been with us. >> Did you pick it up? >> You haven't been with us every single time. What I'm asking you, >> I don't know that. You're right. I don't know. I don't see it. You're right. Then everything unexpectedly cooled down a bit. Another officer recognized the cameraman from years earlier and spoke to him much more respectfully, completely changing the tone of the encounter. Makes you wonder how different the first few minutes would have looked if someone had simply approached the situation like an adult instead of just assuming confrontation solved everything. I don't live here. >> I said, "You're being nice about it, telling us >> I got really no issues with you guys because I've had a lot of interactions with you and I understand he was in a little bit of a bad mood today, but like we normally are pretty good." I was trying to explain that to you and then he >> give it until tomorrow I should be in a better mood. >> Yeah, I I know that and I know you're up and down with that. And I'm not telling you you can't be outside. I'm telling you that we've talked about obstruction. >> You can't sit still. >> You just can't sit still, >> right? And and I I know that you told me before that you were friendly with them, but apparently something must happen. >> Well, if we have to go on there for now cuz I'm not moving all the [ __ ] to an elevator cuz I don't have a >> The problem is the only problem I have, Alex, is that you can't like obstruct the sidewalk with a bunch of >> No, no, I get that. That's not what I'm saying. I'm way past that. >> I don't know, man. I think your ego is blocking more of the sidewalk with this guy. >> I think you're annoying. There's a certain time where I have to be back off there before they get in tomorrow. Okay. Now, you were telling me. So, are we good? You guys, we're good. >> Give me a minute. My back is a little >> Thank you, Alex. So, >> I forgot your name. >> Megan, thank you. >> Oh, Matthew. >> Now that I've addressed them, I'm I'm out. >> Would you like to move your illegally parked car, or would you like me to issue you a ticket? >> I would not prefer a ticket. I can't afford. >> I'll tell you what. Since you don't think I'm a nice guy, >> I didn't say I didn't say I don't think you're a nice guy. >> Why? Because I'm a big guy. >> You haven't hit me with a stick. You have you haven't tried to. >> Rather than arguing about rights, the officers explained previous interactions with the homeless men and claimed repeated complaints centered on trash and blocked sidewalks. Whether the viewers agreed or not, this was the first time anyone actually offered meaningful context instead of vague accusations. Funny how productive communication suddenly became once everybody stopped talking over one another. >> I can tell you something, Matthew. >> Think of way other things that you could have said. >> I'm a big dog lover. >> Yeah. Oh. I even have to talk. >> So, we're going to let it slide, right? >> Oh, it's cuz of my dog. >> I don't want to tow you. I don't want to tow your car or anything like that. >> So, we're good, right, Matthew? >> It's because of my dog. >> Is that the same dog you've had like 7 years ago? >> 12 years. >> She's 11 now. >> Take you out. >> I want Can I share a story with you? >> Yeah. >> All right. I was a sheriff >> when you came to court. I think you had an issue with maybe it was Ripa or something. Was it Ripto? >> Uh, >> I don't know if you could speak on it. after litigations. I'm not no longer able to speak on that matter. >> But you brought your dog into the courtroom that time and they made a big deal or whatever it was. >> Yeah. >> Listen, I I I've met that dog before. If that's the same dog, I met that dog. I got no issues with you or the dog or anything at all. What I got issues with is >> actually >> my favorite show. But all right, listen. What I got issues with is this. It's very simple. I get what you're trying to do and I get what you do. >> I got no problems with that. I listen I walk around with a camera on just like you videotape it. I'm videaping it. >> But I want to share something with you. So our job is complex. It's not a one It's not a one day thing, right? You don't know how many times that I've interacted with these two sitting. >> By now, the officer made it clear he had no intention of writing a ticket or towing the vehicle despite spending several minutes threatening exactly that outcome. He even joked about the cameraman's dog and recalled meeting it years before in court. So which is it? Was this serious enough to justify a detention or casual enough to end with stories about pets >> here? When there's human feces on the ground, urine on the ground, last week we had a felony assault right here. >> You're here to serve and protect. >> So, and that's what I'm trying to do. >> That's not helping though. >> Okay. So, what I'm trying to tell you is when I'm talking to them with nothing to do with you, that's not helping either cuz you really had no business. >> Where is he going to go? >> And just so you know, your car was parked here prior to me even getting out of my car. What if he gets up and where he goes is causes problems because where he was nobody gave a [ __ ] >> People do care. That's why we're here. Cuz they call >> If they cared, they would [ __ ] get him out of the situation he's in. >> I've tried to help him. I've tried to get >> Yo, your government [ __ ] takes care of him. That's how good they take care of him. >> I've tried to get him to go to a shelter. >> Your taxes pay for this. >> Okay. >> He's not a drug addict. Like the [ __ ] What the [ __ ] wrong with you people? >> I told them I spoke, >> right? He's not a drug. Your taxes pay for him. He doesn't get enough money to [ __ ] live your taxes pay for this. It's your fault you're pushing it. >> It's your fault. >> Huh? It's because you're pushing him. He has no [ __ ] money. Where do you expect him to go? >> Pushing him down the street. Push. You can't Don't stop moving. >> Just keep moving. Just keep moving until they all have sleep deprivation and they [ __ ] yell at you cuz they can't sleep. You're out of contact. >> Oh, >> that's what it is. That's what happened. That's what's really happening. The medical problem. >> The conversation soon shifted away from law enforcement and toward the larger homelessness crisis. The cameraman argued these men weren't criminals, but people the system had failed. While the officer pointed out to shelters and government resources that could potentially help. Here's the thing. Police officers can't solve homelessness. But they also can't police people simply because society hasn't solved it either. Are we really paying taxes for officers to move struggling people from one sidewalk to another without fixing anything? >> Really happening here is you tell people they can't they can't [ __ ] stop until they delirious and then you have to hit them over the [ __ ] head with stick. >> No, I don't. I knew it. >> No, but we figured >> I just fig >> I don't give a [ __ ] My life. That's right. >> I don't. But if I see him, I'll take a picture. I'll show you. I'll show you guys. >> You go to the hospital. You look really cold. >> No, I'm all right. >> You sure? Yeah, I'm cool. I'm going to be leaving. >> You're like really cold. Like >> Yeah, I'm just hanging out with him. I haven't seen him in a while. >> But you got a place to go tonight. >> Yeah, I stay 15 minutes. >> I don't considering my options right now. >> All right. It's going to be cold in >> I've been through it before last. >> You know that you can flag this down if you need. >> Yeah, if I need to talk or something. >> Thanks, guys. Appreciate it. Megan, Alex, thank you. All right. What's up with this stuff anyway? But I'll be here tomorrow because I can't I I can't allow >> Just as long as you don't leave a big mess on the sidewalk. I don't care. >> Honestly, I think it was a little mess. >> A few moments later, the tension completely disappeared as everyone checked on one of the homeless men who looked cold. The officer spoke respectfully, offered assistance if needed, and the conversation briefly became exactly what community policing is supposed to look like. Should we really be happy that he's finally doing his job? >> Just as long as you don't leave a mess, we're good. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. >> All right. >> I don't want to give you a ticket, my man. It hurt you financially. If you can move your car, I'd appreciate it. If you leave it here, we'll give you a ticket, but we don't have to do that. If you have a handicap placard in the future, I would suggest you display it so that because you are in a handicap spot. >> So, what would you like me to do? Would you like me to just let you go, or do you want to >> Of course. You know, the all American way. Just let us all go. >> All right. Do you want one of our cards that has our badge numbers on it? No, you're pretty cordial. You answered all the questions properly. Let me now just for the camera since it's been on this long. >> Let Let me ask. >> So, do do I need papers for my service animal? >> To be honest with you, I'm not going to answer something I don't know, though. I would look it up >> if I need if I need if I need to. I would look it up if something I don't know. Um >> I don't know what constitute a service. Before leaving, the officer once again emphasized he didn't want to issue any parking ticket and simply just asked the cameraman to move his vehicle. Looking back, that's what made the earlier detention so confusing. If the situation could end with a friendly request, why spend several minutes escalating it into an investigation first animal? I think you would need some kind of documentation to prove that it's a service animal. I know there's different levels of service animals. There's emotional support. There's, you know, people that have PTSD. There's people that have, you know, been in the military. is people. There's there's all different kinds of service animals. Someone that has a service animal might know more about it. >> So, check this out. In layman's terms, 37% of America is eligible for for to have a service animal. And the federal law states that any disabled person can train their own dog. >> Okay. Oh, okay. So, you're basically saying anybody can have one, right? >> Pretty much. And that I have no problem with that. >> Yeah. Basically, but on the understanding of it, if you get called to say it's a fake service animal, when you show up, that means you're either supposed to give the business a ticket for lying or the person a ticket for having >> I don't think we should issue a ticket for lying. >> Well, a ticket for writing tickets all day. >> Not when I say for lying for saying for pushing the person to the point where they were uncomfortable in the business. >> Okay. So, and understanding um yeah, you're called >> by Megan. Hey, if you don't go inside, see, don't see this is why I get mad. But it's okay. But >> I want to go back. I just >> All right. Make sure you warm up. All right. If if the police gets called to a business for for a service dog, >> the the the police is supposed to um >> Interestingly, the discussion torn toward service animals after the cameraman asked what documentation was legally required. The officer openly admitted he didn't know the answer and encouraged him to look into it further. Well, credit where it's due. Too many officers pretend they know every lie ever written. Well, this one simply admitted when he wasn't certain. be able to assess whether or not the business could say that this dog um wasn't able to be corrected. And then at that point, either the the dog would get a ticket or you would be able to say that the the dog they the business is being biased and the dog didn't do anything. And you have to warn them at that point of a $75,000 fine. And then at that point, if they're not willing to follow, let them in. And they and >> so Matt So Matthew, right? Yeah. Would you like me to call you Matthew? >> So, this is the reason why I have a problem, okay? Cuz this is what happens. They'll put stuff down and then it turns into this. And that's why we prohibit that. Also, if you look up city ordinances, there's a city ordinance for blocking for obstructing. >> I didn't say right or wrong. >> But that's not the solution. >> No. So, if you knew why I was even stepping here, you would have said something to me. What I was really stopping them was to talk to them, make sure they were okay, and I had a question for them. But then you interjected and started this whole big >> Well, I waited till you was telling being a little pushy and then I was like, "Oh, let me turn the camera on." >> My camera's been on the whole since I got out of the car. You know what I mean? >> That's what I started. >> Listen, I don't I I hope you know by now by this interaction that this is how I treat people on a daily basis, whether a camera's on or not. >> No, I know. I believe it. Most of you do. >> So, so I >> People think that I only that I only antagonize cops to [ __ ] >> Soon enough, the discussion returned to the sidewalk where everything had begun. The officer explained he originally wanted to check on the homeless men because of an earlier assault in the area, while the cameraman insisted officers shouldn't immediately pressure people to move along. Community policing works best when people believe officers are there to help, not when every contact feels like the beginning of an eviction notice. >> Beat you with a stick. You know what I mean? >> I don't think that at all. But I do think you should stand back and wait and see why the police are even there before you make an assumption because you really didn't even know why I was stopping him. I was actually stopping to talk to them because the other day, two days ago, we had a felony assault occur here and I know they know the people that did it. So that's why I was stopping to talk to them. >> Yeah, but this this is important and this look that up. >> When you read this, hey, when you read this all the way through, it says you don't have the right to tell us to move off the sidewalk. >> Okay. Well, I'll look that up and I'll compare that to I'll look that up and I'll look that up. >> You know what the problem with this is? >> Go ahead. Even when you look it up, the problem is after after what 10 years this has been on the ballot, nobody's enforced this. >> So, I'll look it up. I listen, Matthew, I promise you, I will look that up and I will compare to our some of our city and I'll see, you know, what where we can stand legally with that. >> If you get called, if you get called for a complaint, >> Mhm. >> and you're not investigating that crime, >> you ask me to leave because their opinion, it doesn't matter to say it. >> [laughter] >> It doesn't matter to say, "Oh, and they could ask anybody to leave." That's discrimination if they don't have a reasonable explanation. And if you guys aren't going to deal with that, some real [ __ ] has to change. >> You can't just tell people to leave. >> Based off our interaction today, do you think I did handled what I handled correctly or incorrectly? >> I don't think you should tell people to get off the sidewalk. >> Near the end, both sides began talking less about this specific encounter and more about the system itself. From the officer's attitude, you can tell they realized they were in the wrong and that this whole situation could have just been over in a few minutes. But hey, better late than never, right? >> Well, I did everything in in the legal from a legal aspect. I did everything I could. >> I think if you wanted them to get off the sidewalk, you should have brought them [ __ ] dinner, bro. >> Then they would have got up because they had something to eat, something to get away from. >> And I've never bought anybody dinner. >> I didn't say that. I didn't say that. >> And I'm not saying it like it should come out of your pocket, but I am saying it. What I am saying it like is is to come out of the you're >> I I understand you have a problem with the system, >> bro. You got people that are and you know they're way above you and they have no [ __ ] clue telling you what to do. You say, "Okay, I'll do it." And you know it's not the solution. The real >> I'll tell you this. This is how I police. >> If America Look, look, if America is going to solve this problem, right? >> Yep. >> You're here dealing with it. You're going to have a real solution. >> This is how I police. I just want to explain something to you real quick. I police like this. I treat people in the street. >> Four guys that you turn their head for. >> I I treat people in the street. >> You're not even listening. That's your problem. You have a listening problem. I I listen to you the whole time. Okay. I treat people the way I would want to be treated or I would want my family to be treated. Okay. That's how I treat them. That's why they have a good rapport. >> Most people do. >> In the final moments, the encounter ended about as peacefully as anyone could have hoped. The officer simply asked the cameraman to park somewhere else, offered his badge information, and wished everyone else well before leaving. After everything that happened, it's almost unbelievable nobody was arrested, handcuffed, or threatened any further, which is something that definitely can't be said about our last case today. A motorcyclist was pulled over after deputies claimed they couldn't see his license plate. But within moments, that explanation started falling apart. As the conversation continued, the original reason for the stop kept changing, raising a much bigger question about whether his motorcycle followed the rules. Got stopped for having no tag. But there's a tag and it's horizontal horizontally plated. It's got a white illuminant light and that's the reason for the stop, which is not true. >> And they're running the system. Yeah, you going to have >> I don't answer questions, man. >> I don't answer questions. >> Okay, that's fine. >> But you're over here. You're over here talking, so >> Oh, I'm just saying this for the camera. >> Okay, Gabriel, do you have insurance on the bike? >> I do. >> Okay. Can I see the proof of that, please? >> Yes, you may. >> Uh, the obscured obstruction of your plate. >> Oh, is it? >> Is it? Is it? >> You can't see it reasonably. >> You went by me like 20 times, dude. >> Yeah, cuz I knew you guys were going to try and pull me over. >> What color? >> It's white. You want some light? Go ahead. Try it. >> Why you trying to bait us then? >> Because I knew you guys would do this [ __ ] >> and I'm getting it on camera. >> Go back over there to the sidewalk. >> Is that off order? >> Yes, it is. >> You want to go in handcuffs. >> White light here real quick. >> Is that law order? >> Yes, it is. >> Okay, there you go. >> Tell me, can you read that tag? >> I can. >> 55. You think I make that up? I just got the tag a month ago. You think I make that up? [ __ ] you. >> Okay, >> read that perfectly. >> Sit on the curb. Now, >> from the very beginning, the rider challenged the deputy's explanation by pointing out his light was mounted legally, illuminated with a white light, and had been visible every time they had passed him earlier. Then, one deputy admitted they had seen him driving for quite a while before finally deciding to stop him. If the plate truly wasn't visible, why wait until after multiple encounters to suddenly treat it as a traffic violation? >> I'm done with you. You guys are pathetic. >> I don't answer questions. >> Well, I need an updated uh address for you. >> Why? >> Uh because you I need to have one for your citation. >> It's on the license. >> Okay. Is Spencer Lane still a good address for you? >> I don't answer questions. >> So, I need to know your updated address or I can't write you a citation. >> I don't answer questions. >> Okay. And if I think that you're going to disobey the citation and not go to court because it's not going to go to the right address, then you go to jail tonight. Okay. >> All right. >> So, it's just a simple question. It's yes or no for Spencer Lane. >> Yes. >> Okay. Perfect. >> And is there a tag late at all? >> Um, very very little. Here, I'll can't have underlow like that. Can't have underlow. >> Okay. >> He didn't even know that. He's asking a supervisor. 34 6 >> poor supervisor. >> What's that? >> What? I want to talk to you. >> Okay. >> You're on camera, too. >> Orders they gave me and they let me go without even getting my identification. Things escalated almost immediately when the rider refused to answer investigative questions beyond providing the documents legally required during a traffic stop. Instead of simply just writing a citation if one was justified, deputies quickly shifted toward commands, threats of handcuffs, and demands for additional information. And before long, another legal issue entered the picture. >> They're stopping me. Same reason. This time, they're giving me a lot of trouble for it, and they're going to tow my bike. Lord, >> are you just narrating the video? >> Yes, I am, sir. >> I just didn't know if you had a question or anything. >> No, you're good. >> Crying shame though. >> What? What do you think? We're like picking you out or something? >> Oh, yeah. >> He's only been driving around for the last hour trying to bait me to stop him. So, >> he said that. So, this is a retaliatory stop. >> No, it's not. I I didn't see a tag on it any single time. You went >> You didn't see a tag on it? Why didn't you stop me then? >> Because I was going to another call stop reason for the stop. So the the lights are illegal. Um the you can't have like underglow like that, stuff like that. Little stuff not a big deal >> because they knew it was not even a probable cause for a stop and that is not probable cause. >> Soon afterward, another deputy joined the conversation and unintentionally made things even more interesting. He mentioned the rider had been driving nearly for an hour and even suggested he might have been trying to bait deputies into stopping him. Think about that for a second. If officers genuinely believed a traffic violation did exist, the proper response would have been to stop him immediately, not follow him around waiting for a better opportunity. Stop. Because the license plate is visible. It's horizontal and it's illuminated. That is the law. But it's not obscured. I I get it. But it's not obscured. It's not covered. And you can see it. I can read it right here at up this angle. That's taller than you are in the Explorer and he's even lower. So, he has way more visibility than I do right now. But if I was at his angle right now, I could see it even better. I can even see when it expires. >> So, a couple things. So, first of all, a motor motorcycle endorsement, which you already >> Yes. But he wouldn't have known that until he pulled me over after an unreasonable stop. >> That is But okay, putting that aside about the lights. I get that. But the reason for the stop was the plates. The reason for the stop was the plates, not the lights. If he said the reason for the stop was the lights, then I understand you completely. But he said the reason for the stop was the plate, which is illegal. >> What? Like the way it's mounted or what are you saying? >> No, he said I cannot see your plate. He said you do not have a tag. >> Oh, well because of the cuz So you have to have a tag light that is white. >> It is. So it is. >> I thought it's green. >> No. Look. >> May I turn it on? May I turn it on for you? It is illuminated white. >> It is following the law. >> So when I get really close to here, I can. But so the law is 50 ft. When I'm 50 ft, the green light is so the green LEDs are so powerful that they they quote unquote wash out that white light. Yeah. And also, I know you guys were also fishing for stuff because >> as the writer calmly explained why the plate was visible from multiple angles, the deputies gradually shifted away from claiming there was no tag at all and began talking about decorative lighting instead. That's a pretty significant change. Reasonable suspicion isn't supposed to evolve every few minutes until officers finally discover something that might justify the stop. The legality of a traffic stop depends on what officers knew before activating their lights, not what they noticed afterward. >> Do you see how it has a radar detector right there? >> Yeah, but I don't Oh, you don't. Okay. So, one of you was lighting me up all the way back >> at the 355 to 85. >> Well, just keep doing your I understand. >> Yeah, listen. Don't worry about him. But he had me on speed the whole way down trying to get me for speed. >> He wanted probable cause for speed. >> Runs all the time back here in the front. Sorry. >> That's fine. >> But you got to understand I'm starting to get really upset with you guys. >> I don't know if you want to understand, but I'm really upset with you guys right now. >> Okay. So make So make >> you guys have been getting a lot of problems. >> Okay. So I'm the supervisor of these guys. Tell me what the Tell me what they're doing. That's that's a problem. >> The problem is the reason for the stop. That's it. >> The reason for the stop is unlawful. >> It is horizontal. It's You can see it. I can see it right now. >> I can see it 50 ft away. And even if you light it up, I can still read it. >> But it has to be It has to be readily illuminated at a distance of 50 ft. >> It is with a white, but the white light is washed out by the green light. >> But it still has a white light, which is But pause. But pause. Let me just break this down. Okay. I can't tell that when you have the green light on, it washes it out. Just like if this deputy turns off his light. When the supervising officer finally stepped in, the tone immediately became more professional. Instead of arguing, he actually listened while the rider carefully explained why he believed the stop itself violated the Fourth Amendment. Listening first usually produces better policing than shouting first and explaining later. But even with a calmer conversation, the original problem never disappeared. whatever the the all the flashing lights crazy. They drown out the white light. It it just is what it is. Um and also the green light's illegal and that is what it is. And >> but that wasn't for but that wasn't the reason for the stop which is why I'm upset. >> The reason for the stop was the plate. >> But he but he brought that up to me about the light as well. >> He did mention the light. Correct. But that's a secondary thing for him. >> But that's not the reason for the stop. It's not a secondary stop. Yes. But that's the reason for the stop. The plate was the reason for the stop which is horizontal. >> Also the light. >> No, he said the reason for the stop was I you do not have a tag and then he went to investigate the bike and discovered that it had a tag and then he mentioned the lights. >> Okay. So these are all issues you could bring up in court. >> I will definitely >> So I would say in the future not have that on >> so that way it doesn't wash out the plate. >> So I was just but I was not doing anything that was a moving violation. I wasn't speeding. I was not running any lights. I followed all turn signals. I followed all the turning maneuvers, all of that, and they saw it. Cuz if I didn't, they would have pulled me over for that. And then they would have mentioned the plate and the light. >> It was mounted a little bit different than that. >> Yes, sir. >> And I changed it because of that. >> I fixed it because of that. And now I'm still getting harassed by it. >> Okay. >> That's we have the other totally get it. We have the other issue with the light again. And I wasn't here for the initial encounter. Maybe he was trying to get more out. I don't know. Uh but >> rather than becoming confrontational, the supervisor reminded the writer that he could challenge every citation in court, which is absolutely true, but also highlighted a frustrating reality. Winning in court still costs time, money, and often an attorney. So, here's the question. Should innocent people really have to spend months proving a traffic stop never should have happened in the first place? Uh but yeah, it is what it is. We'll work through this. You'll have your day in court. Anything you want to contest, by all means, you can do it there. That's absolutely your constitutional right to make the all the arguments you're making to me right now. >> I am only upset with him. >> He is my only problem. >> What? >> And he is the same officer that blew me over last time. >> What is it about him that ticks you off? >> That he only wants me for something. >> Okay. >> He is he has been following me for probably 3 miles >> and I have not violated any moving violation. I turned I gave signals. I did the hands. I stopped at all the lights. I turned. I was not speeding. And yet he still wants to find something on me. I'm not saying he has to do everything in Frederick County, but I'm saying when someone's not doing anything wrong in your view, leave him alone. That's all I'm saying. And now I got to pay a whole bunch more money for more lawyers and more tickets. People can afford it like that. >> I totally get it. cuz I put all this money trying to fix the bike for you guys and you guys still don't like it. That's very upsetting. >> Applauded one part of you, you know, regardless of and I respect your constitutional right to contest whatever the deputy's allegations were for the traffic stop to be done in court and not being enough. >> The rider then explained this wasn't the first encounter with the same deputy and believed he had been singled out long before the traffic stop actually occurred. Even the supervisor admitted the rider had been driving legally and hadn't observed any moving violations himself. Makes you wonder what would have happened if the motorcycle hadn't had decorative lighting at all. Would deputies have simply found another reason to pull him over >> head and like running or like you said blasting lights and doing all that because I can >> and that was the reason for the stop which makes this very upsetting. >> Okay. Well, I can attest you drove by me probably 20 times and not a single time did I see that tag on it. >> Really? Okay. >> And that's 100% true. So you can have one of your buddies hop on it when you get it back. You drive behind them or have them ride past you a couple times, whatever. I guarantee you're not going to see that bag on there. >> He's a Richard owner, right? >> Yeah. >> The business card. >> That way it's one less hoop for him to jump through. Mhm. Anything in this uh saddle bag you need? >> Not that I want you to search, please. >> Your gloves, sir. >> All right. There is your license. All right. These are four citations. Okay. Driving vehicle in violation of restricted license requirement. uh fail to properly place or position your registration plate to your vehicle. Driving vehicle without adequate rear registration plate elimination because I can't read it from within 50 feet and f to the >> In the end, deputies handed the rider four separate citations including the very plate violations he had spent the last 10 minutes disputing. And even after accepting that paperwork, he remained respectful toward the supervisor while making it clear he felt targeted by the deputy who initiated the stop. If you thought today's cases were as bad as policing can get, don't get too comfortable. The next video takes things even further with incidents that are even harder to believe. Which case do you think could possibly top what you just watched? Trust me, you won't want to miss the next video. See you in the next one.