[Music]
if you could do me a favor uh mr denver
start from the beginning
of how you became involved into this
investigation overhanging
i was at the police station at the older
one at the
217 speed control one next to the
library in the fire department
i just walked into the traffic office
i just finished working out that's my
normal routine as soon as i
finish working out i go straight into my
office and just warm up my food
and uh my camera is done like what the
microwave is like we have our docking
station for
our axon cameras and uh this is my
normal routine just grab my food
put my camera back on and let it charge
while i'm working out
put the camera on i started warming up
my food and
i heard sergeant savage say over our
main channel or channel one
saying that uh telling the dispatcher if
they can get relayed the information to
us
about the state police officer that was
shot so i caught my attention i turned
up the radio because
i had like my my personal radio the one
that's on my duty belt
and there's a radio uh like granitex or
microwave
like a big radio with the speaker so i
turned it up you know i was paying
attention see what was going on
see if it was like in cruises or
somewhere else and uh
you know just waiting for the
information to come out and that's what
they said you know it was like
it was coming into that cruises this is
the near damning area
i-10 and uh you know they're asking for
assistance
since i was already you know at the
station you on i got no
nothing else to do i got to go and help
these guys out
so i ran to my car dumped in my
my camaro and i turned on my my axon
camera
and turned on my lights and sirens left
the police station came down gumbo
middle right
on two sprues made that very first left
onto grumple street
just kept going southbound i was just
trying to in my head i was just trying
to figure out like the fastest way
possible to get there yeah
so i mean it's just a straight if you go
down campo go down amador it's just a
nice straight shot all the way through
so i just continued as soon as i got to
gobble made a right-hand turn onto
amador street just continued all the way
west
you know just paying attention to the
radio to see like you know where
the suspect was going i heard officer
gomez 738 get on the radio saying that
the
suspect you know is eastbound on 10.
i don't remember like the mile mark i
think they think 144 or something like
that
i didn't know exactly where where that
is but uh
like i know like where 140 is something
all right you know it's like
four miles gonna be going westbound so i
just kept going down amador street and
that's when i came up to
uh motel it took me a little while to
clear that intersection
there's a lot of other units dassault
you know passing through there's
had overheard uh
that works with us saying that he was
setting up spike strips and i got some
too
and as soon as i came up to where
officer legareta was which was
like i10 and uh it wasn't exactly the
motel except but it was pretty nearby
it was like like what the sign is like
underneath
where it says you know motel accent and
uh
i couldn't really find like a safe spot
for me to go and deploy stop stick
i thought it would be uh too much having
like you know two officers there
at that point because i saw uh i don't
know if it was
state police or the sheriff's department
it was a big suv the towns
i saw them stopping near that spot as
well too so i said screw you know what
i need to go a little further west in my
mind i was thinking
so if you continue going west there's
going to be a bridge
and you know that'd be like a really
good safe spot for me to park
and deploy my stop sticks it's a
concrete barrier of it even if he starts
coming towards me there's no way
he can get to that concrete barrier
so i was hauling ass i was going um
going west that's when they said that
you know he had crashed out
um going into the desert or something i
was like oh no
it's no reason for me to pull over and
deploy stop stick if this guy crashed
the house i just gunned it
kept going west started going towards
like where these guys are at
and uh you know that's when they say you
know
he's still like continuing going i was
like oh [ __ ]
so maybe i do need to set up spike
strips in but out my original spot
you know that there's no way i could
have gone there on time to get to that
spot
so i was i i slowed down
i got into the center median pretty much
right
right across where the uh the rest stop
is
for that big uh rotator there you go
yeah so i was thinking i was looking
straight i was trying to see if i can
position my car anywhere safely to
play the stop stick so i was thinking
maybe if i go straight across
i can go against traffic to like like
let's say you're at the rest stop
you're coming down the hill and that
you're you're merging onto the highway
yes
tell us maybe i can go up that so i'm
like on higher grounds and he starts
coming towards me
he's you know he's going to hit
something he's not going to hit me
but that was me paying attention to um
to where i wanted to put the stop stick
and then when i look to my right the
suspect's already here
i was like oh [ __ ] he's already here
like
well you know what you know i just saw
like a bunch of uh suvs like i know
state police dassault doesn't do a pit
maneuver
[ __ ] i gotta help these guys out i just
gunned it turn on my lights and sirens
as soon as i know i cut off one of the
i don't know if i was a sheriff or a
state police guy you know i kind of
misjudged
how fast they were going i thought they
were going a little slower
they uh i guess they were going a lot
faster because i gunned it and they
still like came right up on me
and uh i came to the far right because
the dazzle guy was on the left and we
kind of like paralleled each other
and i passed the the civilians that were
the two lanes i passed on the shoulder
and i was able to catch up to the
suspect pretty quick you know my car was
a lot quicker than he is and i started
gaining over the car i'm blending for
the pit
and then all of a sudden um
he was like a chevy pickup truck he has
that back window where
where it slides open in the center that
window was already open
and i just remember him like he was
driving with his left hand he was
turning around
he was looking at me like sticking the
handgun out of that little window
and uh instead of like just firing
randomly like he was actually like
following me he was tracking me like
and then i can see him like stopping i
was like oh [ __ ] man like this guy
this guy knows his [ __ ] if he's like
taking his time to aim at me and
everything he's not just
you know shooting randomly like you see
like on tv or whatever like most videos
you see
so i remember just like hitting the
brake just trying to trick him
i'll hit the brake and just kind of like
jerk my wheel
just so that i'm not like going like in
the exact same path
like every time as soon as he would fire
you know i would i would move out of the
way again he was continued he would uh
stick his
hand out that little window aim at me
and fire some more
this was like [ __ ] you know i got hurry
up and hit this guy
so i waited for him to turn around and
like look straight again you know pay
attention to the roadway
so i started getting up on them but you
know he would have given the chance he
would turn around and start firing
and then once we started getting closer
to the motel x i was like you know
i can't do it now because there's too
many officers i know
i remember i don't remember who else was
there but i remember joaquin being there
uh from my department so i got to back
off i remember getting on the radio and
saying hey
uh you know we're approaching you
joaquin
and uh i don't think i hit the brakes or
anything i think i just got off on the
gas you know just so i can give him time
to deploy the
stop stick and i saw the suspect like
pretty much like riding
in between both lanes and he ran over
the spike strip
and uh i just remember
i'm pretty sure i moved to the the right
side of the roadway trying to avoid the
spike strips
and uh the suspect fired some more
rounds at me
and i just remember looking down at my
dash and my dash was flashing
and it was saying zero psi like in the
left front tire okay
so like [ __ ] i got a [ __ ] tire that's
blown out
so i just remember like just checking my
steering
like like to me my car felt good it
didn't feel like it was damaged or
there was a tire or maybe the the dash
is [ __ ] up or something
so we're going and uh
you know by then i can see the
well i couldn't see him anymore what the
hell i thought
well i'm sorry let me back up a little
bit that
he ran over the spike strips as soon as
he passed
you know that's where i saw my light
flashing but then i just heard a
shitload of gunshots
and i saw there was a bunch of officers
on the left side i don't know if it was
a
state police or dassault but i heard a
bunch of gunshots and i heard like a
rule of like distinct sound like like it
was hitting something it's like oh man i
think that thing they got him
it sounded like my car got hit too as
soon as i passed i remember hearing like
two different sounds
they sounded different than the ones
that were hitting him
and that's when i saw him slumped over
and i was like oh
thank god this guy got [ __ ] hit or
whatever so i got on the radio
i started telling people on the radio
that uh
that he was slumped over but then i
realized that you know he's still
like driving straight you know it's not
like drifting to one side or anything
like maybe he's not hit so i was just
just watching and paying attention see
what he's doing
so i told myself you know like it's time
to go in for the pit but then
we were like a better curve and i was
like no this isn't
this isn't a good spot if i do the pit
there's way too much traffic right here
i'm gonna put like too many people in
danger or whatever
so i just i hesitated a few more seconds
and as soon as we came
uh clear from where all those people
were at
i saw him pop back up he's back to
driving he's not
no longer firing him he says it screw it
gunned it
went in for the pit on the uh on the on
the driver's side of the car
but since his tires were blown like
from what i remember it was like the two
rear that we're blowing i don't know
about the front
so i knew i told myself you're gonna
have to give it a little bit more
steering
uh to cause this vehicle to lose
traction because
you know if your suspect vehicle is like
on tires it breaks
traction pretty easy especially at those
speeds the faster you're going the
easier the pit is
so i was like no i got to do a little
bit more steering so um you know my
car's kind of low his on the pickup
truck i kind of gained a little bit i
was like oh no
my car is actually like the right size
you know i'm not going to go underneath
him or anything so i started going in
for the pit
and i did that like the quarter steering
it still wasn't really working so like
screw it
this isn't a good uh isn't a good idea
because now me and the suspect are face
to face
like if i continue going this way you
know there's a chance for him to start
firing at me
so i let off let him straighten out and
i kind of tricked him i kind of stayed
right there like if i was gonna go back
in for a pit
and then i just i shot off to the right
side and i went in for the pit on the uh
on the passenger side so that one's
alright i'm gonna put a little bit more
steering into it
and sure enough the truck breaks
traction it's doing exactly what it's
supposed to be doing
for me it was like a huge relief was all
right you know i'm [ __ ] stopping this
guy
you know it's time to get ready just
remember like telling myself
have your seat butt off as soon as the
car like slows down just jump the [ __ ]
out
get out of the car so his vehicle's
spinning it's almost coming to a
complete stop and
like the way i teach pit in the academy
is we're supposed to
pass the the suspect and we're actually
supposed to be ahead but
there's no way i can do that i'll be
like way behind the power curve
you know but i'll lose like a second or
two like passing him all the time i get
out i got to face the other way
so i was like no i got to stay here so i
just remember like jerking the wheel to
the right and kind of like
getting closer to him you know instead
of being like so far away
i just like jumped out i got the [ __ ]
hit on him now
i'm gonna be faster and then as soon as
i
put him apart he was already right there
so it's like what the [ __ ] i'm supposed
to have to hit on this guy in order to
jump on this guy
but he's got me beating like i'm getting
the [ __ ] out
jump out of the car i don't remember
like unholstering i just remember like
having my gun
i fire i guess that's when i get hit
because
i just remember i remember falling
as soon as i fell man i was like man i'm
[ __ ]
i'm on the ground you know like
you stole my son don't give up i'm
already on the ground
i'm saying to take this [ __ ] shot i
just remember like
rolling over to my right side a little
bit my head my my gun was already out i
think it was
leaning on me laying on my on my right
arm
so i'm just going to take out his feet
but then
i didn't see his feet move anymore
because i saw him at first like in front
of my car
but then like they kind of shifted over
to like where my my left front tire is
so it's like all right you know that's a
good sign because he's no longer coming
at me so like
i was like you got to get the [ __ ] up
man so i just remember like popping up
and as soon as i popped up
i don't know if i was still like
kneeling or all the way up but i can see
him
so i just started shooting and i saw him
it looked like i hit him
because i just remember him like like
crunching down
and then he turned for me and then he
like started running back towards his
truck
so all i can see was his head uh
like they say this is the bed of the
pickup truck all i saw was like his head
and then all of a sudden he just like
dropped
i was like no i gotta go get him you
know this is
you know i gotta take the fight to this
guy so i kind of just
came around the corner took my time a
little bit remember seeing like his legs
move and i saw the gun on the ground i
remember like if he was holding it but i
just remember seeing the gun
so i just kept firing and that's when my
my handgun
was already empty the slide was locked
to the rear i reloaded
and uh when i reloaded i was like all
right you know like take a deep breath i
you know to me look like you know he was
like out of the fight he wasn't moving
or anything anymore this is over with
take a deep breath and that's when i
realized like something was wrong
i didn't feel right like everything just
probably goes on fire
i went to go holster my gun i just
remember like my arm wasn't moving
like it was moving but it wasn't doing
what it was supposed to be doing
it wasn't it wasn't going back it was
only doing like this motion
sounds like i got freaked out i was like
i gotta get away from everybody like i
don't want to be like next to this guy
so i started taking steps back i i tried
to go holster my gun again
and i couldn't i just remember like
holding on to it because i didn't want
to drop
it like just in case i gotta get into
like another shooting or something i
don't know if there was like anybody
else in the car i just remember
looking at his like driver uh
seat i i never checked the passenger
side
so i just kept it here like just in case
i i got to shoot again
i'll be ready my mind already told
myself you know i have a
another magazine in there i tried
getting on the police radio but
i don't know if your radio is the same
when we press ours there's like a little
beep and then you can start talking
kept pressing it no beep was coming i
was getting pissed off
because i want to tell them you know
that i'm injured
and uh i don't think i even had my
police radar i don't remember
turning it on or anything so i just kept
backing up and then when i turned around
i saw ramito coming in and i told him
like
i'm hit and that's when he got on the
radio and
told everybody else and i actually had
to
help i asked them for help to put my gun
away because i couldn't do it
that's pretty much it also yes sir okay
all right and then let me go back uh
jessica because i heard you said you
taught the fit
maneuver yes sir so you go to i guess a
special school to teach the pit
yes i've gone to two different schools
the first one i went to was at vsr
west virginia it's actually like an
agency that teaches uh
like law enforcement they teach private
security
they teach a secret service and
everybody
so i did a week school through them i
did the ebook school and then
secondary was the pit and then
i also taught the dps
version of that class it was taught by
state police
up in santa fe at their at their academy
so the dps version you teach that as
well to other
law enforcement agencies or yes
basically if you cannot study illegal
guards
you can kind of give us your history as
far as your department involvement
your training what you teach at the
academy how long you've been doing that
stuff
i've been teaching the academy since
i started in traffic in 2009 but i
didn't start teaching until like 2010
and i teach the like the crash portion
you know that scene and teach all that
stuff
in the past i taught like radio
procedures
uh pt instructor for the cadets
um i believe it was like 2015 when i got
certified through
through dsr to be an evoc instructor
that's when i started with the
police department to be an epoch
instructor and i teach
the academy and well i teach every
academy
and then i also do like the by bingham
training so
all current officers that are working
through the las cruces police department
you know have to do that that mandate
training every two years and then we go
over the pit
i'm also a motorcycle instructor
i've been teaching that at pretty much
the exact same time as the z-box
i did it within the same month when i
got certified
the cadets is pretty much all i've been
teaching lately and then just
you know being a pt instructor and
i think you said it but how many years
have you been on with las cruces
17 17 years
and outside of the the academy training
and regular buying i'm trying to get any
specialized training
you know such as the evox stuff but as
far as firearms or anything like that
outside the police department no i just
you know take like advanced
courses through the police department
like that yeah yeah i've taken uh
numerous classes like i did like the
advanced uh
handgun course i've done it several
times because uh
i carried a different handgun at the
time so when i got my new one
i want to be proficient and now i'm just
getting more experience
so i took the class again just so i can
be more comfortable with that gun i've
taken like the
advanced one several times with the
rifle
i've done courses
since i'm a motorcycle officer
i've taken courses or you know shooting
getting off the motorcycle to using the
motorcycle for cover
i've also done like an advanced school
in denver colorado
up there and that was also the range of
driving and everything
it was rifle and handgun
and that's pretty much what you're
nervous for as far as you're training
yourself and
your training yes
i just wanted to go i back know you said
you were talking yourself as when you
were getting out of
your vehicle after the pit was
administered yeah
and you said once you got out or while
you were in your car
that you saw the suspect i believe i was
still inside
because i just remember like
just telling myself all right i'm gonna
be like one step ahead of him
and i already had took off the seat belt
like i already know like i'm ready to
jump
out you know i'm ready to just like you
know to get in the fight with this guy
but then like as soon as i put it into
park like i just remember like seeing
him i was like
how do you gain you're so [ __ ] fast i
mean that's the part that freaked me out
like i just jumped out of the car
i know i know everything's moving so
fast uh when you
saw him in front of your car did you did
you see anything else at the time
or just him just hit him yeah i did i
mean his truck
i could see like my car and i could see
that nobody was behind him
i mean that made me feel better because
you know there's not like all these
people standing there there wasn't a
bunch of cars or anything like that
uh but pretty much as far as what you
heard on the radio
uh did you ever hear of i guess uh who
the suspect was
was no okay just the description of the
distribution
and the only reason that officer's party
you were in pursuit of him
was because he had shot a new mexico
state police officer yes
and they actually had related on the
radio and he was officer our
sergeant record he said that officer had
passed away
it was 10 7 passed away
and then i guess i'll go back to where
you were at the road runner
uh rest area yes so from there
you sped up and you took the lead based
on because
you're familiar with that so not
performing pits correct correct
and you passed how did you ask them
i was so you had the two lanes on i-10
the sheriff's department was on the left
i believe he's like on the left kind of
like the shoulder
because i remember cars being right
there yeah so i pass on the shoulder of
the roadway
so i can go back uh i've actually done
uh
like an advanced class with uh dazzle as
well like
we we did a training where it was uh
instructors
and shooting instructors and we kind of
did like a training like all in one day
so it was uh so we got to do training
like with both
and that that's when i remember them
like you know they don't teach the pit
or anything like that
so you decide at that point to go ahead
and take the lead to perform the
newer based on that information based on
your training and everything
as you're proceeding down there's a
point you say because of that window
that's open
yes um when he turns and he starts
looking at you and he's pointing the gun
at you
could you decipher at that point or
determine what type of gun or what
if it was a handgun it was a handgun
yeah i don't know like what
type or anything but definitely a
handgun like a sidearm like we carry
yes okay um and you said he was he was
pretty much
tracking you for the most part yes he
was taking his time
and just to clear that up when you said
he was tracking you
it appeared as this was somebody who was
not your average
yeah that was like the first thing i
popped in my head because i was
as soon as i saw the gun i was waiting
for him just to just like
unload the whole the whole magazine or
whatever
but he didn't do that i mean he was just
like you know just taking his time like
he would wait and then you just stop and
then you
you know fire off those rounds that's
what i knew like you know i can't just
be going straight i got to be moving
around instead you know like make him
work for him yeah
then
so when you were i guess after the whole
incident and
you were shot correct yes sir where were
you shot
the bullet came in my bicep like right
in the center
and then exited out through my lap like
this portion of my back
okay so i mean i basically went to the
side of your wrist through it
yeah i missed my vest yes and you were
wearing your
basic body armor yes that yeah the body
over but then
as far as uniform wise you're wearing
your las cruces universe full uniform
full of traffic uniforms
if you can't describe that what the
traffic clinic uh uniform
traffic uniform we wear long sleeves uh
my vest is actually underneath my shirt
so i wear like you know
the class b shirt over my vest or the
the strap that goes across like the
state police one uh
i wear the motorcycle pants with the
silver stripe coming down
you know they're pretty tight you know
that they can be loose or anything
because when you're riding a motorcycle
and then i wear like the high boots you
know protect me from getting burned on
the motorcycle
and then descriptive as far as your unit
the camaro i mean it's not your normal
police car but if you can describe
that yeah so in the traffic section we
use we have two camaros
there are 2011 camaro super sports you
know fully marked they got the decals
and everything lights
on top but we use those for
traffic enforcement you know a lot of
times you know people don't realize it's
a cop car and so it'll be easier for us
to
to run like radar on highways or
neighborhoods or anything
he said they don't realize it's uh law
enforcement but i mean
it does have well yeah it has all the
details yeah
once everything's initiated yeah what's
in the ignition okay yeah actually like
my unit
pi has the most lights out of any any
unit
in our fleet actually i had them at uh
extra lights since you know i worked
during the day and i wanted my car to be
pretty visible because all i do is just
um
you know traffic enforcement and crash
investigation so my car's like always
parked
but the lights on so i want it to be
pretty visible
at this point okay okay this time i will
conclude this interview once again i
thank you for coming in
uh for both of you coming and providing
the statement for us
you