and you killed her you killed her and then you didn't just leave her there you drove her to Grapevine stand up and man up and tell us what you did for This Girl's family I'm I'm admitting to it I can't remember killing anyone this is 30-year-old Charles Bryant a Serial stalker who just took the life of an innocent young girl and despite his claims of Innocence little does he know that every single one of his crimes has been caught on camera we have video of you with this girl should you're at the bar her cell phone goes to your house you're walking around Walmart at 4:00 in the morning buying a shovel on the night of September 14th 2016 24-year-old Jackie Vandergriff an aspiring college student wanted to meet someone she had matched with on Tinder unbeknownst to her this would be the worst decision of her life because she was meeting 30-year-old Charles Bryant a dangerous man with a history of stalking so severe that he had a warrant out for his arrest not knowing any of this Jackie goes to meet Charles at 5:54 p.m. in the Fry Street Public House a local cafe the two would then spend the next 3 hours together having drinks and talking sometime around 8:45 p.m. they decide to call it a night but Jackie doesn't go to her own home a critical mistake that sealed her fate instead she gets in the car with Charles by 8:52 Charles makes a stop at a 7eleven buying drinks and food before driving Jackie to his home in Haslet Texas where he lived with his roommates the next time that Charles was captured on camera was in the early morning hours of the next day at approximately 4:00 a.m. where he visits a gas station but this time he isn't buying drinks instead he buys a shovel while Jackie isn't anywhere to be seen however she would be discovered very soon the very next day three individuals trying to put out a bushire in Grapevine Park found a mutilated and burnt corpse with a head and limbs chopped off this was Jackie and she had been brutally murdered by Charles but what pushed Charles to murder her and what happened during the time that Jackie was missing to answer these questions Charles Bryant was brought in for an interview 4 days later on September 18th unfortunately getting Charles to talk wasn't going to be as easy as officers imagined because he would go on to deny everything obviously there's been some issues that you've had up in u this is an ongoing issue correct with yeah okay um that is not what I'm want to talk to you about what I'm W to talk to you is another case okay and what I'm going to do is I'm going to show you a picture of a female that I'd like you to tell me if you recognize who she is think so a bar okay what can you tell me about her that's about it I guess well there's always more than just s at a bar is what you're saying uh was it Tuesday Tuesday night when uh I'm drink with Katie she's a bartender okay uh Katie bartender where Public House Public House okay all right so you're you're having drinks with Kae the bartender is she actually bartend right there yeah she bartends just friend get cheap drinks okay so you get there and we're saying it's Tuesday you get there about what time then 6ish 7 say in the evening time obviously and um were you planning on meeting anyone in there just ktie okay um she knew you were coming or is that just a usual thing for you to do to go there no she knew talk okay she's a front okay do you normally go there um during the week or weekend last few weeks we've been friends for like a month I guess but as far as anything what I'm talking about like consistency of you going um up there because we're we're talking about up there in Denton area where you're talking about yeah okay do you go up there frequently um that's like a month and a half give take mainly because St and Caitlyn and then we parted ways and I met Katie but okay and so Katie a relationship going right now can no we're just friends just friends okay um so up there Tuesday you meet her and then you said that you did recognize this young lady as somebody up there at that she was in the bar she was in the bar um how did that happen she did was she with a group or something or I don't know um she's talking a bunch of girls and it's like there's just a bunch of girls that's din there well I mean as far as did you ever to talk to her yeah she was T us she drank um I'll talk to anyone who's there but not okay um did you ever sit with her the other girls ever hang around them and talk to some of them interact any interaction with them other because the way the way you kind of make it sound to me right now is that you're kind of standing in one area and they're in the other area and you're just kind of watching like this would be the bar and then like literally just here and they're over here okay here so you're over here they're over here gap between the two of y'all and what that's that's all you recall no just literally drinking and bsing um I know she was talking to Katie about I don't know I was I was there to drink sure I'm driving so I over cable you're at you're at a bar that's that's typically it and in plus to to possibly meet people but you're up there what to hang out with Katie though yeah okay so so you weren't really looking to hook up that particular night Katie was a friend that's why you went up there yeah okay although I wouldn't mind hooking up with um I haven't seen her so um so anyway as far as any direct conversation with this young lady that you had I really just bsing but nothing memorable so I talked to a bunch of people that night okay um did you wind up well I mean how long did you do you stay there at um at the public thing uh ktie got off at 9: and then I know I was home about 11:30 on on that night uh what did which way did you go home I mean out um I go out leave there just go towards 35 so it's westbound okay so southbound you taking what 35 W it's which one goes to it's 35 West right it go south yes the one okay CU they split in yeah to go to go this way something crazy okay okay okay so just straight down southbound 35 W what you're saying and and I think you said uh you said you stopped for maybe for some water or something had water my car like just went home got malt liquer before like I even left and I was just in my car like I don't know if you've ever had on like they have Mike's Hard orange soda yeah it's pretty good but um I had that before um Kool-Aid with alcohol essentially yeah it's a sweet treat but other than that I mean did you are you saying you you bought that that was before I even saw K oh okay so that was before you went to the bar yeah this was straight shot home okay so straight home and you took 35 back home and when you left uh and that's kind of maybe on a scale of 10 1 to 10 you know one being completely sober 10 being you know fall out fall down i' go six seveners maybe okay okay more than gooh enough to drive but okay well you you made it home that's that's good so you you you're functional a little bit so I mean FR well enough that you remember everything May that was going on that night you wasn't like I woke up in the bed I I know I was in then you know I woke up next thing I know yeah next thing I know I woke up in the bed so I mean because you told us about Curtis to drive home whatever so and so you pretty much knew what was going on that night pay very close attention to the approach that Charles takes when telling his story he refuses to even acknowledge the nearly 3 hours that he spent talking with Jackie all caught on CCTV and very soon this conversation is about to take a turn so drastic that you will see Charles Persona do a complete 180 this young lady right here when I said missing she's missing from this world with the ones who are alive this is a homicide investigation she was located Wednesday morning in our city so that same girl that you saw that's why we're wanting to talk to you now okay um that's insane and Charles you know I I feel confident you know more than what you're telling us on this um this is one of those things that this has happened already okay but the thing is you need to really get out on front of this because what kind of what kind of happens is that you know when there if there's charges that are filed against somebody who has committed such a a terrible act it's one of those things that the jury gets an opportunity to kind of hear and see what's going on right to see how this person reacted maybe when contacted by law enforcement is this something they're remorseful for is this something that they're going to just completely continue to lie about it you know so what I'm doing right now Charles is I want to get to the truth you telling me that you just saw her at a distance is not true that's like I don't nowhere that's insane it's like that's just blowing my mind now we have video from those bars at Frost Street that totally it's different from what you're telling us and your interaction with her okay so reconsider what you're telling us right now because every little lie that you tell us it makes us doubt even the truth that you may want to come up with so was drunken that thought it's like I don't really remember anything that's insane well I mean you what you saying you drer than you thought you were I mean you you PR gave us some pretty good details as far as your movement that night I mean you pretty much remember where you were you know the times you were there you know when you got home whatever you know so you know that's just you know and we have we talked about you know you you you had something to drink you about six to seven you know but you knew what was going on yeah that's what I got there um so something else I need you to think about and consider while we're all sitting here together because this is the time that we need to talk and that is your cell phone right now we've seized it we'll be going through it your car we've seized it we're going to be going through it your house we've seized it we're going to be going through it and so is there any reason why we're going going to find either her DNA in your vehicle her DNA in your house any of her clothes or articles in your house in your car I don't have anything nothing no okay is there going to be any reason that DNA is going to be found on her body that belongs to you I I didn't touch her we drinking exactly so you're saying there is no way you're DNA is going to show up on her on that um okay um as far as I I can always offer you a consent um to give us a sample of your DNA and that can be through like a buckle swab uh Q uh the Q-tips that go inside the mouth kind of thing is that something that you would consent for us to take because the thing is is by no means am I going to say that that your DNA is there but my question is could it be there and then at that point in time what I need to do is I need to confirm that that that is your DNA or it's not your DNA you know what I'm saying so if I if I get the DNA from you then that's a known sample right there from you I can't mistake that for somebody else at that point in time okay so I will grab well you know what I think I've got it right here with me right now let me go ahead and do that real quick for the next few minutes officers conduct a Buckle swab test on Charles this is because the DNA obtained here can be cross referenced to several items found in his vehicle when he was initially arrested these included a Sig sour mosquito pistol a stun gun and a zip tie that had golden strands of hair stuck to them in fact there had even been blood stains in his vehicle that seemed dried up all that was left was to search his house something that would prove to be the most critical part of incriminating Charles but for now officers need to keep mounting the pressure on him in hopes of getting a clean confession like I said if there was anything that you told us up to this point right now that has not been the truth I I can't express it enough how important it is to make sure that we have the truth right now um because it doesn't do anything to try to get the truth later yeah right because then it's you're not credible at that point in time because you've already lied to us understand and so we do during this process right now that if there was something that you decided not to tell us up front but have now started thinking about it and going now I'm going to look like a liar if I come back and change it this is the time to do it right now before we basically make this your statement and say this is what Charles told us this is what he said happened it's what goes in the print right yeah but everything that you told us up to this point how I recall it like I don't remember even black out drunk I leav in public house it's rain now but I remember talking that girl that left were you driving um that meishi vehicle up there that's all I have okay now that we kind of know what this is about now you understand obviously the seriousness behind this yeah um when I'm telling you that we're going through your phone your car your house that's not something that happens on on I don't know like a petty theft or something you know this is this has gotten very serious and so I need you to also realize that things that are going to be uncovered things that are going to be found that that's truly going to dictate the course everything else from this point on goes and so again I want to make sure you understand we need the truth right now yeah even like that drunk when I left um stuff in the bar I don't talk to anyone on but I was drunk have it but I don't really remember talking to that girl that much and also you know we want to understand is that you know even though you know what you're saying is not adding up to what we're we're seeing you know we're going to check these facts of what you're saying you know we're going to talk to Curtis and you know and do that and is there any reason that he's not going to say the exact same thing you you say that you talk to him he talk to me and the next day it's like they're outside again want come Mar yeah step out real quick I'm going see if I can get a hold of him okay you don't WR chance know his number by heart D I didn't think you would so there's Curtis can confirm this conversation that you guys had that night and we're going to talk to him and you know and he not being in this situation he's probably going to tell the truth about it and so I just want to be 100% sure that he's going to confirm this conversation the time it took place when it take place uh and I know you said you slept 9 to 9ish or whatever that next morning did did did you ever leave the house again or much just passed out that's how call it but but you know it's just some some some gaps in and that's you know some things that you're seeing and some things that we're seeing that's not adding up right you know so I want to be you know at this point you know our the video that we have is not adding up to what you're saying so you know I'm going to talk to a person that can actually confirm which is Curtis that this conversation took place at the exact same time okay so just to be doubly sure he's going to confirm this conversation took place at that same time yeah talk Curtis um about that time frame okay you know was anybody else present besides Curtis that you can recall besides yourself and Curtis on your side of the fence that you said uh tan Tanner yeah Tanner okay and his girlfriend were home and you're saying they were passed out that night I didn't see them okay oh you didn't you didn't actually see them no they the room okay okay for more context Curtis is Charles's neighbor and if anyone knew what happened after the two drove home it would be him according to police reports Curtis had actually approached one of the FBI response teams and told them that when Charles left for the store at 4:00 a.m. he asked him how to get away with murder to which Curtis replied jokingly probably by burning it Charles L remembers this conversation yet he still refuses to crack and give any information however considering that he has gone as red as a tomato he is clearly anxious this is why to bank on their opportunity another detective enters the room a detective that would take the most aggressive approach by far Charles you want something to drink thanks man I'm Sergeant Henley we haven't met I feel like I know you though because I've been watching the going on or whatnot and I keep hearing you say you don't know what's going on you don't remember you don't this you don't that come on man we we we've we've laid it out for you okay it's there nothing great we're over there at your house okay you we have video of you with this girl should you're at the bar her cell phone goes to your house you're walking around Walmart at 4:00 in the morning buying a shovel she's dead in a pool that came from your backyard okay you can't tell me you you can't tell me you don't remember I don't know why come on man well I'm I'm giving you you were there obviously you did all these things and there is no way in the world that a man could travel all the way from Haslet to Grapevine from Denton to Haslet to Grapevine and not remember stand up and man up and tell us what you did for This Girl's family I'm I'm admitting to it I can't remember killing anyone man you got to there's no way you remember all the big things in your life okay very few are bigger than taking another human life yeah it's pretty drastic I know it's in there okay and appar know you got it in you I know how talk to me I'm tell me the past hour and a half I've been racking my brain there's no way man there's no way in the world that you do not remember this there's no way woke up I don't even remember taking her home I thought I was home she went to your house yeah I don't remember taking her to my place man I don't I thought I went home by myself and you killed her you killed her and then you didn't just leave her there you drove her to Grapevine tell me you don't remember that putting her in the car come on you were at the bar Wither in Denton y'all drove to your house you killed her you drove her to Grape Vine and you don't remember any of that that's when we were waking up and hung over I don't know how I can kill someone man I don't it's like it's not me but obviously it is me it's like I just out of all those things that I've told you there how is that possible that you don't remember I don't think I was that drunk I really don't it's it's not about being drunk Charles these the people kill people when they're drunk because they drive down the road and they they they hit them okay they don't murder them and then take them to another place look at me man they don't I've been doing this for 25 years okay I've heard a lot of blackout stories I've seen a lot of blackout stories this is not a blackout story and the fact that you can't look me in the eyes I don't remember man I don't it's down in there and it's Weighing on you it's dragging you down this entire thing is I know and you would at least feel better telling you something I don't know telling me the truth I don't know man you do know Charles there's no way you could not know this there's no way brother there's no way at all I'm telling you okay you get drunk you forget where you left your car keys you forget where you parked the car you forget you're you're you go to the wrong house you knock on the wrong door you don't kill someone load them up in your car drive them to the park where you like to hang out at okay I've been out there today I saw the tree where you first kissed cait under Caitlyn was Charles's ex and one that suffered greatly because of his obsessive Behavior right after the two broke up in late August of the same year Charles began stalking Caitlyn even when he was given a court order to stay away he was found standing outside her dorm room with flowers it's in the same part brother you know where it's at if you're drunk you don't know that you took her back to where you started your relationship with Caitlyn and she [ __ ] on you why why would I do it to this girl I don't because you're pissed off cuz she's got you arrested she's filing charges against you cuz she's out hooking up with other guys so you know what I'm going to go out I'm going to hook up with another girl and something happened something happened and you killed this girl it's not apparently that you did we found her purse at your house we have video of you with her the purse was not the only thing that officers found at Charles's home besides Jackie's tote bag officers also discovered a knife that tested positive for Jackie's DNA as well as several zip ties with her hair stuck inside lastly officers decided to use satellite imagery on the home and noticed that two similar holes had been dug out in the backyard these were also surrounded by the same blue plastic that the remains were found wrapped in according to roommates Charles said he wanted to make a koi pond which is why he was digging the holes which was obviously a lie I just remember waking up man there has to be something about this night that you remember has to be I really don't even remember why would you okay when why would I go back to a place that I frequent when did the person when did the purse end up in the trash I don't know I didn't even know the purse was in the trash okay so so did it go in the trash the next day when you woke up or was this part of the blur that was the night before I didn't know there was a purse what about the zip my house what about the zip ties with her hair in it I have zip ties in my car so so you have zip ties in your car okay my emergency kit thing and it's got her hair in it is that what you used to tire up before you killed her man I don't know I really don't know it was it was along with Detective Taylor in here it was it was us three that went and told the parents and the one thing the one thing that they looked at us and they asked they said was it long and drawn out was it painful did she suffer and you know what what the only thing we can say is we don't know but they need to know and you need to tell them you've done something bad but that doesn't mean you're evil that doesn't mean you're not savable okay but you need to tell those parents right now how this happened to their little girl and that's how you're going to save you I don't know man I really don't come on Charles I'm racking my brain I have this you're racking your brain have you I don't have to Rack my brain to know I didn't kill anyone this week okay I just woke up I Wednesday was like run-of the mill for me it's like I was just hung over I remember brother let me tell you something Wednesday was not run-ofthe-mill for you just woke up like 9 something blow my mind really I gave you everything I have I don't remember but but you you haven't Charles you hadn't told us anything all it's been is US telling you what we have we know never mind we know I mean out of the three people sitting in this room right now the only people that don't know you did this is you and it's not possible it's not possible POS there's way too much involved you know you tried to get rid of her you tried to get it away from you why go to plays that frequent makes no sense but because you were familiar with it H I know this girl do it I get it but I mean you you've got two three detectives that have been talking to you now for I don't know a couple hours or so that are that are telling you that you did something atrocious it's horrible it's [ __ ] it's heinous it's it's it's the worst of the worst and all you can say is it's blowing my mind really he's a real person yeah do do you feel like he's a pretty upstanding kind of guy I have like him I mean the the thing is that he's a family man I mean that it gives him some credibility he's not evicted from his house he seems to be paying bills so at least from society's point of view he seems like a pretty upstanding kind of person right and so you're going to now what we're going to do is we're going to put ctis on that on that witness stand and and and we're going to be asking him those very question so tell us Curtis what kind of conversation did you have with Charles what did he say you've got to be kidding me he asked even about DNA and what did you tell him and he said well you burn it well guess what our victim here was abandoned in the park and burned so Charles you got to give this up man I'm not I don't have a front I'm telling you this this is a selfdefense this is a self-defense is what it is and I understand the worst thing to do is to have to admit something like this that you were responsible for that's the worst thing to have no if I remembered it like if I you have to remember cuz why are you having these conversations with your neighbor the following day I about everything even like how destroy DNA it's like I don't remember that it's like I talk to him about all sorts of [ __ ] but you you remember going to the first bar you remember talking to a guy you met the week before you don't remember anything that you did wrong isn't that a little convenient believe um I think you did okay and and I'm just going to go ahead and I'm just going to throw that out there I I think you did and I I think there's two there there's two things that may be going on here right now either you're trying to cover your ass I'm ad to it by coming by coming up with this I don't know I was too drunk to to know what I was doing thing or it is Weighing on you so heavy what you did to this girl that you're trying to block it out and I'm I'm telling you the the you'll feel better if you tell us the truth not that I'll feel better cuz I already got you I'm telling you we've got all we've got hang on a second you just keep reiterating the same thing I got it but we've got all these people out here that are pulling evidence out of your house that you did this okay that's on me I know it's on you I cannot remember I don't know how or why it's like maybe did I maybe you don't want to think that I did this but I'm telling you you did and the sooner you come to grips with that I have literally I'm here I'm talking to you brother you have not come to grips with this because we're talking about taking someone's life me losing mine in jail I get it I got it exactly you can't just shrug that off I'm not shrugging on my life is my life is I get it but you can't just say done mindblowing it is my life's I'm literally in jail the rest of my life for some I can't recall it's like I don't remember leaving with this girl I vaguely remember even talking to her I don't remember getting that drunk I thought I went home alone I hope someday that you do yeah I'm trying I've been trying so hard you keep pestering me this I'm not trying to pester you Charles I'm really not I'm I'm you want answers and I get it I want answers too because I'm here it's not just that I want answers it's that the fact that this is such a terrible terrible thing that you're not even showing any kind of remorse concern you're just kind of like it's mindblowing and you're shrugging your shoulders and you're like I'm and this that and the other thing but you're not showing anything for this poor young lady this lady that will never have the opportunity to have children she will never their parents will not have grandchildren she will never know what it's like to get married she won't know what it's like to graduate from college she won't know what it's like to get get her first professional job she won't know any of these things because her life came to an end that night that's huge it's not just mindblowing and I can see it in you I can see in you that you want to stand up and you want to take I'm taking credit for I don't I can't I don't know how it happened I don't I don't know why we end up in Grapevine I don't know how I wake up and like not remember this because you come to Great Vine you go to the park F would I go to a place that I go oh my God it makes no sense to me why would you leave her purse in your trash can at your house yeah I don't know I don't get it why would you leave zip ties from your car with her hair in it at your house I don't know but see you laugh and this is because it's BL it's not laughing matter it's literally you're in my face I have nothing to do right now it's like I'm not in your face I'm a few feet away I'm trying to every time we start to talk and I start to to talk about emotion and I start to try to make you understand how this hang on a second okay you keep interrupting me and that's the nervousness okay and he's been saying the same thing it's give me one shot okay every time I start to talk about emotion and every time I start to talk about the human Humanity of this young lady and the humanity of you you shut down your eyes go to the floor I'm TR you shrug you say it blows my mind and all that this is not mindblowing we're talking mindblowing we're talking about the end of two lives two lives hers and yours yeah it's not mindblowing what's mindblowing is that you can't remember anything from I don't know why I would want to it's like it doesn't make sense man it doesn't it doesn't yeah one of these days you're going to have to come to terms with this or it will coming it will haunt you for the rest of your life it will haunt you for the rest of your life store you do remember going the store you don't remember going to the store why would you get a shovel and cough medicine at 4:00 in the morning see if if we were talking about you got arrested for DWI and you went to the store in the middle of the night and bought cough medicine in a shovel I would think that'd be something to laugh about but when we're sitting here telling you that you killed a young lady I wouldn't think that would be something to laugh about notable by any means but you just laughed not really it's just nervous laughter even I'm not even nervous it's just well I'm I'm glad you're not nervous I'm not trying to make you nervous clearly Charles wasn't going to be letting up this act of Amnesia anytime soon more importantly officers were at a standstill they still had no answers as to why or how the murder took place this is why officers call in Texas Ranger James Holland a law enforcement celebrity because of his extraordinary skill in eliciting confessions not only does he have his own Wikipedia page but he's also been nicknamed the serial killer Whisperer because of his talent in interrogations if anyone could get Charles to to talk and navigate the mind of a killer it would be Ranger James and as soon as he sits down with Charles there is an immediate contrast compared to the first interview I'll kind of explain that a little bit more I'm guessing today that you probably have about 10,000 questions wondering what's going on and everything I over everything is today oh okay okay uh I figured you'd be curious about what's going on and what's going to happen next and a little but yeah okay all right uh I brought you a cup of coffee if you want that knock yourself out hey what I can do today and it's up to you and I kind of want to um I guess um be as straight up with you as I can from the get-go okay I'm not going to sit here and lie to you or blow smoke or anything like that I'm kind of this realist person uh sometimes people don't always want to hear what I have to say but stra forward well and that's that's basically me okay um but today we can get started another words you can ask me some questions I can tell you some things I I don't have any questions for you okay I mean I really I don't as we get going maybe maybe I I'll think of something but I really don't um I was asked to come in um and kind of help uh and I was actually ordered down here uh Yesterday by the governor after a phone call to our chief um um but I just um thought you know you might want to ask some things and I can probably explain some things to you um all that being said you have been arrested right you know that you're in custody and you're in jail and all that stuff okay I'm not going to violate your rights I'm not going to do anything wrong I'm going to read you Miranda and then um at this point you steer the boat and I don't know if that makes's talking okay okay if at any time that you decide that you don't want to talk to me or you don't want to answer a question or you don't want to just let me know okay and then we'll call it since Charles was given enough time to contemplate he is about to make a confession not even 10 minutes into this interview tell me what's going on today why why are you wearing the Village People outfit right um Tuesday it's like I didn't have anything else for you to wear that's it I was wearing my shorts and like I got to changing this but I don't mind um yeah it's crazy cuz I really don't remember me this world it's like I met her at Public House and um a public house yeah it's a bar in jenton oh okay okay and like we left there and I thought we kind of parted ways but we were at another bar drinking and that but apparently she was with me um came back to my place and I don't remember driving home with her which is insane and but yeah um CU I got a text like the following day cuz like really I just found out yesterday it's like look out here Le us back she's dead like that's insane but um one of my clients she texts me and she's like oh yeah there's a body found and it's like great behind like Cara and just like we were close to that area and my that's [ __ ] insane and um I was like let's just train somewhere else the following day cuz we're supposed to train on Friday morning but yeah out was me and it's just not it's like I don't even know this girl it's like I don't remember her name and it's just it's blown my mind cuz it's so a character me it's like I'm I'm not an angry guy I'm not aggressive it's it's I don't know I've been trying to think over it last night and I just don't remember leaving with her it's like cuz all I remember is like she was this this tiny little thing I commented on thatx I wouldn't s my friend Katie and she's a bartender and we were drinking there and um I've been there pretty much all day just cuz um I was going through some crap with my ex and called lawyer blah blah blah blah and I just want to go drink with Katie but I didn't think I was that drunk I remember going home I thought I went home alone I didn't but I'm taking it's like all EV is all me it's like I'm just can't I can't remember doing it but it's me it's totally me there's no doubt about it but I was going to go forward with it I don't know where I'm going to go it's jail it's I'm fine with that um one of the detectives yesterday was saying that Texas has a death penalty I'm like all right great I'm GNA die in jail but I can't I can't fight it it's obviously me I just I remember doing anything cuz um they're giving me time frames and I was like I woke up at like 9: I just felt like really groggy and tired thought it was just hung over but yeah they're like you're here here and here I'm like but a simple confession like this doesn't mean the case comes to a close here Ranger still needs to figure out the details of what happened and most importantly why it happened do you know the difference between a good person and a bad person I think so what honest do what's good do you um do you think that the the pope ever does anything wrong you Catholic yeah I was RA Catholic for a little bit all right well we got something in common did you go to Catholic schools too um for a little bit and then um Mom I convert over Christianity I went to like a Christian private school for a little bit but um did you have a a sister mother Mary claresa like I had who used to beat the [ __ ] out of you with the ruler no I don't have her so side note here when I was in third grade sister mother Mary Clarissa we would uh she would say all right everyone let's get up and we're going to go to the laboratory and I would always get excited I was like yeah we're going to the laboratory this is going to be awesome and every time we'd end up in the damn bathroom you know as a kid I didn't know laat I was thinking we're always going to the laboratory but one thing that I do remember and it never made any sense to me is if she caught you with your hands in your pockets that you would have to take your hands out with the ruler and it took me years to to figure it out I had no clue you hit my hand yeah well I I didn't know do you know why you couldn't pocket pool really you know I'm I'm in in third grade and and I'm I'm I got you know took me until I was like 27 to figure that stuff a book called last Catholic in America about this kid who grows up in in Catholic grade schools and it's it's hilarious and that's actually how I figured out why Mother Teresa was beating the [ __ ] out of my hands with the ruler yeah why that was going on but so you know is there is there a mitigation of Damages yeah and it comes down to that question you know does Mother Teresa did she ever make mistakes did the Pope ever make mistakes yeah absolutely everyone makes mistakes you make mistakes I make mistakes pretty well there's different degrees of it all right but at the end of the day what's the difference between a good person and a bad person well a bad person makes a mistake and he walks on down the road and he never says he's sorry and he never makes amends he just goes a good person they make a mistake and they say that they're sorry and they make a well and they beg for forgiveness there's a you know what is amends in this case well I think there's a lot of questions you know uh that people have that obviously law enforcement has that I have that you know that the family's going to have that everyone's going to have about you know how does this guy like you how does this how does this happen how do we we get there um so relieving I don't know how it would escalate to where I'd want to take someone's life let alone drive from Denton to my place F well and and let me talk about psychosis a little bit okay because I do primarily what I work as serial killer cases okay so I deal with people that that have uh have gone off the reservation for for one reason or another you know some of them just snapped and some of them it's just this longterm you know issues T Bundy you know it's been going on for 30 years well you're not Ted Bundy I mean obviously you're not a serial killer or anything like that but they asked me to get involved with this because the psychosis that is shown in in the crime scene and what's going on now is is very synonymous with with what I do and I can tell you this so is there a chance that you blacked out and that you don't remember anything yeah absolutely right and that's actually kind of normal where when someone loses it um for whatever reason bam they snap right you ever gotten really really mad and just snapped and kind of lost it and you're you're not thinking straight because well mean it's not it's so weird man but but that's what happens sometimes is is there's a snap and at that time you know can there be this uh blackout stage this psychosis where this person person basically has an out-of- Body Experience where they're seeing this but it's not them doing it and then later basically what they do is they try to erase that that memory from their mind is that a possibility yeah absolutely 10,000% thanks to James linking scientific evidence and convincing Charles that everyone makes mistakes he is far more willing to cooperate to double down on this approach of building Rapport James will even go as far as to offer an alibi of self-defense that Charles can provide she didn't attack you how do we know that that you weren't defending yourself and that you didn't freak out how I mean there's a bunch of things out there we we don't know but there there could be some legitimacy in that you know um you know the sexual stuff in the text I mean maybe she came on to you too strong maybe she um maybe you know she wasn't a 10 you didn't want to be with her maybe you know she got mad maybe she's given you all the signals and and then cut you off I mean there could be all kinds of different things going on here right I mean chicks right you know chicks I'm under attractive doesn't fit my bill like well so you're not attracted to her so let's backtrack for a second so why are you with a girl who's not a perfect 10 you're not attracted do her you don't want to have with this girl so if you just see this girl walking down the street man I want to bang her I mean is that jumping out at you because you're doing Cindy Crawford's daughter and all this other [ __ ] right gel what's what's uh uh who's the uh the quarterback from uh oh who's the one who got in trouble for deflate gate Tom Brady oh yeah jizzel what's her name jel jizel yeah yeah yeah you're you're dating her so let's start walking back through this but how do you know that this girl I mean maybe she's super freak can really into you and maybe she freaks you out a little bit um you know maybe you you you don't want to hit it and maybe that doesn't go well I mean I've had that [ __ ] happen before in other words what I'm saying at the end of the day is there could be some mitigation here right and that's when I talk about it doesn't have to be um end of the game you know obviously you got a body we got a burned up body we got all kinds of things that put it to you but the truth do what sing 12 to 130 from my place I don't believe I thought it was another bar and I was telling them like I thought I saw them in that bar together but I was walking by I was in there we went to two different bars that she was at but you guys are hooking up on Kindle what is it I I never talked about Tinder yeah I don't even have a Tinder account they asked me yesterday I don't have one so they got you with with her on Tinder uh discussing things of a sexual nature it's not me I literally don't have a Tinder so you I've never M at the bar okay any clue why they're throwing that out there I don't know it's like I haven't used a the only a DAT app I've used in a long time is um it's called happen it's like if you cross paths or something they have app to you can talk but have you ever met this chick before never know can you remember what she looks like tiny little blonde girl yeah did they show you a picture yesterday or okay I remember commenting at a public house I was like oh you're really tiny but she was sitting down and she stood up cuz uh was drinking was like oh you're little remember that we kept drinking we all leave around like 9 something because Katie had to leave just split CU I thought I went over to another bar you did you went to a second bar yeah not that one like I thought I went that one and U there's a guy in there who's a bartender yeah they the bartender in there said you were in there tra the check out yeah they show me pictures yesterday the same time be able to my card together or why when I kill someone I don't I don't know how that would escalate so there's a zip tie I had her hair on it well you know what gets you well so this is the swimming pool that's missing from your backyard right it didn't burn up all the way and the edges curled over so your DNA is I mean all over it fingerprints DNA and everything in the back side of the body same thing I mean there's uh DNA on it the other side of the the swimming pool there's DNA there's fingerprints there's uh dog hair that's going to end up matching uh I think your dogs and and you know you got the knife with the that test isn't back yet but the knife that's in your closet is going to come back with her blood on it and um they the reason that they they found out right away is um it didn't it wasn't burned up all the way so they were able to get uh fingernails or I'm sorry fingerprints it's called aphis automatic fingerprinting information system so they can basically the morg rolls are fingerprints CU they're not off there and then that's how we identify our so fast and underneath her nails she's got um some skin uh it's going to come back we believe to you they just got their stuff your DNA yesterday and then I started yeah yeah I started pushing that it was going to be 30 days and I started pushing that last night so the the stuff starts coming back and that's some of those text it's I ask them to to update me as we go through so I know definitive things I can already tell you what you know what's going to be there but the the swimming pool the you know your DNA on her body or what's going to end up being your your dog's hairs and in the the pool on uh on her clothes I mean the um let me show you a couple pictures I'm going to be careful about what I show you I'm not trying to freak you out or anything like that okay do you remember this this swimming pool in your backyard yeah we had a couple okay and I mean did you notice that one of them was missing like back hair is kind of trash yeah that's where one of them was but your your roommates got you out there at 4:00 in the morning um here's the other one it's matching you got two of them one's gone but your roommates got you out there at uh 400 a.m. digging a hole in the in the in the backyard let see if I got a picture of the swimming pool where you dug a hole but you're digging a hole basically where that swimming pool was and he said you're putting in a Kiki Pond you remember that conversation with him Koi pond Koi pond yeah you remember telling him that you were putting in a koi pond at 400 a.m. this was a massive slip up by Charles he instinctively corrects the off officer by saying that it was a koi pond he wanted to build but then immediately tries to cover it up with his Amnesia Story Once More in front of a jury this would lean heavily in favor of the prosecution as it acts to disprove Charles's claims of memory repression that's crazy remember a it's like I saw a shovel next morning and like and so she's wearing a gray shirt basically right but this is what's found on her body and I mean you're you know about DNA mitochondrial touch DNA and all that stuff can fire destroy DNA absolutely 10,000% but you got to burn huh if everything was destroyed yeah well no no it wasn't destroyed this it fire will destroy DNA if you destroy everything but everything's got to be burned but um that's that's not burned so your you know your DNA is going to come back on there um the DNA from from underneath the body is has already come back I mean this is the underside they pick it up but obviously you carried the pool out there you touched the pool when you carried it your dnas all over it one of them had a they found a partial or full um fingerprint see I'm as I'm getting these back these are all my tests coming in DNA positive positive um and and this part that has the rolled up on it uh you know this is where her body's found inside this but you'll see that that nice protection the heat rolled over the edges and your DNA and your fingerprints or know so um a bag you know some of the stuff was wrapped in a bag but the bag didn't burn well mitochondrial DNA is on there I mean between yst uh full range DNA and mitochondrial DNA I mean you're you're all over it and then um you have a stomach can I show you a picture that's little all right the fingernails are intact your DNA you know underneath the fingernails so um how good is your is your can I show you a disgusting picture or not yeah you can all right the back of the body your DNA is on it might cond touch DNA so it didn't get burned I mean you're you're you're all over the place the um I won't show you well can you handle one or not okay the pool underneath not burn not burn you pick it up and it's completely good and then you got the bags that are separated with the clothes in it and uh they're not burned you know I mean you know what she was wearing and and you can see that that's what we have pictures of um I won't show you this next one because it's disgusting but her um mouth is not burned you know so there's we've got uh what's called yst but it's a male strand of DNA uh on her tongue so that's going to you know I'm sure that's going to come back to you and I can show you the if if you want to see it's kind of disgusting picture okay and then this you know in addition to all the video of you leaving together you know still so I mean it's all there you know what's Great Vine huh well and what does Great Vine want to do I mean well kind of they they want to be done you know they reached out because they have something that they're not uh um okay blood on knife matches victim's blood that's what was recovered from your closet so I mean all this comes true but uh you know I think they're happy to walk away you know because they've got you and they don't give a [ __ ] they've already made their case but I'm a little bit different because I I study people you know and and I try to to me unless you know every answer then you don't know what happened all right the benefit of that to you is maybe these answers can help you you know now I'll be honest with you if it's Prett Dam well but I'll be honest with you you know if you remember this whole thing and you're a psychopath serial killer and you dream about this [ __ ] and you do it all the time and then you should just shut up and me to leave and that you don't want to talk to me anymore I don't see that Charles probably chuckled at the absurdity of the situation first James showed him DNA evidence of him being responsible for the murder and now he says that he still has faith in him in a time when he feels like the world is against him these words only soften him up after an aggressive conversation but James still has one more move left up his sleeve one that will make Charles speechless Pizza STK ass SM here thank you can't even smell that probably smells better than being in the back right cold back there I'm same shower since yesterday I'm not sming Mr P there this Mak sense I mean can you think of anything else with the why the zip TI come remember being really tiny I don't think i' have to stra ties no I mean that doesn't that doesn't make any sense oh look at you I'm okay thank you get in way oh actually if you got it I'll trade you cups how's that you want it no okay oh maybe one of those CS back well here I'll try you that it's not that hard well that just shows the disheveled though that just shows it what does that mean it means it is not intentional I don't know to drive there so there there I mean would you agree that nothing after the fact makes any sense I mean you're a smart guy no nothing if you wanted to get rid of a body I mean i' probably want to burn it yeah but would you burn it there yeah so if you were you know had your thoughts about you had your wits where would you go what would you do somewhere fairly desolate yeah so what does that prove Pro out of your mind right I mean no one's home at that moment you're still breathing you're still you but essentially you're having an out-of- body experience I mean that that's what that shows like I said there's a lot of mtig there you know guilty but if you're just this cold blooded calculated killer and you plan to do this okay when I look at this no because who who is going to be dumb enough to be seen on video with a chick at a bar leaving with her on video right and then go kill her who does that people you know saw you with her I mean these aren't your enemies these are people that like you have a lot of respect for you and they're the ones that are picking her out saying yeah he left with her or um he was drinking with her and you know all these other things so you know what does that show well I'm looking at intent you know what's what's your intent well if your intent was to go you know kill a chick and a chick you know are you sadis are you made is your mind defunct where you want to get captured to get caught you know no in jail this but none of those things are you right I mean would you agree with that yeah because if you did want to kill a chick I mean what would you do you get some Alias and go to the library and hook up on Facebook or whatever ever and then meet her at some location that no one knows you some place that fre no your sure as hell not going to go somewhere where the bartender knows you at two places right two different people know you there that's on video and then leave with her I mean that doesn't make any sense who does that not someone who who's intending on you know cutting someone up or killing someone that should make you feel better doesn't it little you want some more of this yeah I'm just not super let me get this out here and let's start working through this you want to take two or three you want me to leave it we I don't know what was in that pizza but whatever it was it was so potent that it sent Charles into a state of complete silence so much so that James has to put him through a guided meditation in order to squeeze more information out of them okay then I what I need you to do is Release Yourself okay and basically what that means is I'm going to try to make you comfortable and relaxed and we're going to go through this not 10% of the time not 20% of the time not 90% of the time but 10,000% of the time this works okay it's just a people way smarter than me came up with it but it deals with the you know random access memory in your brain and it deals with jarring things we could sit here and I could start talking to you about your first bicycle you know as a kid and if I could put you back in that same time frame and and and find one solid thing then we could actually work back through and I could get you to describe the first bike that you ever got when you got it who gave it to you what brand it was and and all those different things do me a favor this only works if you want it to work okay and it's all about relaxation because you have this constriction on your brain right now it's squeezing you it's the the pressure and the stress and all these different things the not knowing right and it's squeezing your brain and it's making it not work so what we need to do first is start relaxing your brain a little bit taking off that constriction and as we do this things start to get clearer and then we anchor ourselves in what you do remember and then we work around that and we move forward and we work around that okay so the first thing I want you to do and what we're going to do is we're going to run through the whole thing we're going to run through exactly what you remember and then we're going to go back to that beginning point and then we'll work from there okay but first of all I want you to close your eyes relax your body okay loosen up your hands there you go straighten your fingers out okay I want you to take a deep breath slowly exhale just take another deep breath slowly exhale deep breath slowly exhale I want you to feel a relaxing sensation in your fingers and your feet and your toes you should start feeling your body relaxing pressure on your eyes and your forehead is slowly dripping away sinuses are starting to open up you're starting to breathe a little bit better I want you to picture blankness in your mind for the next hour and a half Ranger James puts Charles through this exercise and gets him to recount what happened on the night of the murder in hopes of unraveling the details however Charles deserves an Oscar because he keeps up his facade of Amnesia only this time it was excruciatingly slow it is after a break that the two return and another attempt is made to recount what happened but this time Charles is going to give a full confession of what happened including every single one of his Twisted attempts at dismemberment um but I think the first question is going to be the U you know is the consensual yeah force myself on okay and so go back to leaving the bar and you end up where do you end up parking at I don't know it's like down 35 but where I don't know still drinking and this crab all I mean and there's some things that she's just going to want the answer to and the da and and Teran Count's yeah okay is this like one of those okay I'm GNA try this and see if she digs it or it wasn't even hard or anything they're making out just just like that okay has she said she'd done that before or I don't know okay so you start doing that she likes it and then the whole whole um Flex cuff thing where how does that come about where does that come from they just there song I mean did you talk to her about that or I think so okay but and as you go to put this around her I guess you you connect it while it's around her throat in other words you don't put it together and then slip it over her head Ranger James asks about the sexual en in so much detail because Jackie was found to have injuries between C2 and C3 in her spine this injury in particular is a result of strangulation meaning that Jackie could have died while the two were having sex okay no fighting going on and she doesn't say anything she say stop or okay and so you put this on and initially you put it on fairly loose yeah okay and now she's on her back and you're basically I guess yeah okay okay and then when does it start getting tighter does she ever adjust it or do you adjust it or been turn back around okay so then she lays over on her stomach do you flip her over or does she turn over or how's that go get off and she turns around all right but she's laying I mean with her butt all the way down and and you're on top of her okay and are you grabbing it in any way shape or form at that time it just kind of tightens up on on its own adjust it after okay did you see where the front part of it was you know how the how it tightens where was that was it under her body or behind her or was to the side okay did you ever see her tighten it okay so as far as you know she didn't tighten it but she definitely didn't say stop or don't do that okay she doesn't fight you in any way when you put it on all right and so now she's laying on her stomach and you're having with her and you hear it click I didn't hear any clicks I just she stopped like MH so the next point in time the next question of the da is going to happen is okay this happens and let's say it's all consensual right she's into all this why doesn't he do anything to save her or what do you do to save her what what happens after she goes limp do you cut her throat or anything when you're trying to cut it off or okay but at that time there's just no movement you try CPR or doing anything okay and her question you've got a cell phone okay she's got a cell phone so what did you end up doing with her cell phone it's not a bag I even where where we're at okay did you toss it out you think or I mean those are things that are important right you know um if you think that you toss a cell phone out at that location then my thought is well go take us to that location and let us recover the cell phone and that's corroboration to your story but only you know you know the answer to that if you burned it with the body then they're going to find that out when they as they tearing through everything right any clue does cool so what I guess that's a big question she's going to ask all right well if this was an accident this is contential what's he end up doing with the with the cell phone there toss it back down towards the house okay which one and that's what she wants she wants answers I mean she's going to go back to me and say well Ranger does he remember everything and I'm going to say yeah think he remembers everything now um like I said there's a a blackout period And there's a time where you're not going to remember anything but 72 hours it's pretty much coming back and then like I said I mean I've been doing um cognitive interviews for years years and they just you know I've had some really serious victims of crime um I've had some people some actors that uh did some stuff and literally kind of blacked out and it all comes back so it's there huh TOS it but you don't know where going down 35 okay so her question is going to be when she's non-responsive and you cut that off why don't you do anything then to try to help her why don't you call 911 why don't you um do anything like that and and what's the answer freaked out I guess so you're scared and you're freaked out and you already know that she's dead I guess is there anything you could have done at that point to save her I think so okay so at that point in time you're freaked out and and you go home pretty accurate yeah okay and when you're home you make a statement that you kind of sit in the backyard for a little bit and what's going through your mind what are you what are you thinking I mean obviously your life is flashing in front of you but what's your thought process are you debating several options or are you locked into I'm going to get rid of the body or what's going on just R know what to do I guess you yes or you no in other words and I'm not trying to come down on you hard at this point but these are the things that she's going to ask me answ yeah yeah and she expects answers I mean you remember this and and you're saying I mean more or less it's kind of an accident right okay that's fine but you've got all these other things going on so we need to kind of put that together so the question is you're in the backyard and you're sitting there thinking what are the options that you're weighing what do you come up with they just to get rid of body I guess okay so at that point you're you're just scared and you don't want this to ruin your life okay and what options do you do you go through in your mind obviously I gu you think about just burying her in the backyard okay back to work how long do you sit there and think about what you're going to do minutes that okay and then you you go get the shovel and so the next thing that she's going to ask about is it's a weird way of getting rid of body right they don't see that that's why it's it's all over the news uh you know a dismemberment um with with the head removed why do you do that that's the other thing that she's going to want to know I mean what we you said something about it was easier to carry the body was there any other gu was there anything else weird going on I mean were you you know I talked about picturing this girl as someone else was there a time that you pictured her as this girlfriend that did you wrong or did anything like that come into play okay so I mean this is just Jackie is Jackie didn't have anything against her did she do anything bad did she attack you did she nothing like that okay so I guess at the end of the day you cut up the body and that's more or less just to make it easier to get rid of okay so there's one part here that I know you don't want to talk about but again it's corroboration okay they obviously have the body they know exactly what's been done to the body the gas didn't you saw you know the one picture I mean the gas didn't do much to destroy anything and um you know that's why I'm asking you questions well one to bring back what occurred it's why I'm asking you about the body stuff did you the Torso did you put her in a bag or did you put a bag on top of her or are you sure what happened there put in the bag all right yes something was missing and that's what I know you don't want to talk about just trying to think it's like and understand the significance of that okay so Jim you've got this guy and you saying that he's being honest and you want me to believe his story yeah okay but he hasn't told the whole story he's hold something back and she's going to ask me is he hold something back well what's my answer yeah and that's what you have to deal with you know the body had a had a certain cut to it and and you need to fill in that blank and that's the cooperation that he's being completely honest you know and there's just no way around it because it's it's there it's in the pictures it's in the corners report it's guess okay what did you take out which one or both okay did you do anything to the heart after you took it out are you sure again these are things that you would remember and I know that you don't want to talk about these things but piece together it's like yeah only thing I can actually see vividly in my head is like cutting off her arm like I can see that okay but you remember taking out the heart something's missing took out okay the significance of that that's going to be important to her why the heart I mean and that's why I asked you about does something come into play with the ex-girlfriend in this at all okay I don't even want to kill KAIT it's like I don't know want to kill this girl do you know tell me what you did to the heart after you took it out I had to put it in one of my bags okay do you remember what bag ahead of the arms okay which one the head because the arms and the legs are in one bag okay so you put the heart in the in the bag with the head yeah did you do anything else to the heart before you put it in that bag you didn't do any Cuts or do anything to it at all okay and you sure you put it in the bag with the head are you sure okay and that's going to be what the green bag yeah Green Bag okay and and why I that's going to be a huge question why why I would take anything out is that the only thing out I can't give you all that but obviously you're hitting on the right uh right cylinders because I'm asking you what back the heart was in stuff like that so back I guess know signif to me I know how to do it just the moment that I mean is like a military thing kicking back in or is it I mean at the end of the day I guess why does it all happen like that I mean I I get the sex thing and the accident the harder part to swallow is the the dismemberment the decapitation in the in the heart yeah and in the fire what why does it go down like that I mean what is going through your mind when those things happen that just make it easier to move yeah thinking a took your heart out doesn't really justify that by any means right and that's what you know I talk about the truth I mean and that's my job is to figure this whole thing out and figure out the truth and I think that's going to be at the end of the day a giant question you know why did he take out the heart and I don't know that I have an answer you know what do you come up with what do you want me to tell her I can't even rationalize any of it but you remember it can I can see myself putting it in the trash bag okay the last thing she's going to ask me about I and I put down three things Seck cutting fire the fire why do you burn the body SC evidence okay did you know that that would you know presumably wipe out DNA or do you watch CSI I mean what was the logic behind that with everything now laid out in front of them the only thing left to do was charge Charles for the murder of Jackie Vander Griff Charles's defense ultimately did not deny his role in Jackie's death but instead argued that this wasn't premeditated murder as she had died during sex but this was not enough to convince the jury in April 2018 Charles Bryant was convicted of capital murder and was sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole