Who was this? >> Yeah. >> Who's that? >> It's me. >> But the problem is you didn't go back and finish the fight. You went back and you executed somebody. >> Meet Thund Straddder, a man who was caught red-handed killing his romantic rival. And it wasn't just cameras that got him caught. It was a case of the Butterfingers. I >> lost my phone. >> Where did you lose your phone? >> That see I lost it. That's your iPhone 6 Plus right there. >> And now Thunder thinks he can play off his horrific crimes as self-defense. >> He connected here. >> Okay. >> He connected here. >> Uh-huh. >> And he also connected over here. >> But there's a big problem with his story. One that detectives aren't going to let go. >> He never said to you anything about shooting you. The man whooped you with his hands. But in that moment, you weren't scared for your life. You were angry and you had a gun. >> Let me tell you the whole story. post. >> On February 16th, 2020, police in Fort Myers, Florida, raced to Michigan Avenue after multiple calls had flooded their dispatch regarding shots fired. When they arrived, they discovered a young man bleeding out on the pavement from several gunshot wounds to the torso and legs. He was immediately transported to a hospital where he passed away within a matter of hours. His name has never been publicly released, but bits and pieces of his story have been. He was dating a woman named CC, a woman who he had recently found out was also casually seeing this man, Thunder Stroder. And where there's thunder, well, there's lightning. That fact alone had detectives looking in Thunder's direction. But there was something even more telling at the scene. Mounds of evidence, including a cell phone belonging to Thunder. Quickly, detectives brought Thunder into custody where he wasted no time telling detectives all the details. The following footage has been provided to us by the Fort Myers Police Department at the waistband. Look over your hands. Place that hand on your head. Have a seat right there. Right off the bat, Thunder assumes a classic middle school boy pose, which is apt considering the childish excuses that he's going to give law enforcement. >> Much warmer up here. I'm sure >> it is. >> You doing okay? >> My ear hurt. >> Just a headache. Okay. >> All right. Well, I have, you know, a couple things to do. Got my pen in here somewhere. All right. Well, just I know that um CeCe probably mentioned to you Detective Emily Stephanus. Okay. Um I know you spoke with Detective Wellington before a couple years back, few years back now. >> Um [snorts] you know, our goal is always just to get as much information in the facts and just have as much information that we can compile everything and have a clear picture. That's all we want to do. Okay. So, I'm going to do a couple things. Um, because we are talking about something that happened. I'm going to read your Miranda to you and I'm also going to swear you in. Okay. All right. When I mean swear you in as a witness, just like when you would go to court or something and they ask you to put your hand up, do you understand what that means? Um, and have you had your Miranda rights read to you before? >> No. Today? >> Ever? >> Have you ever been arrested before? >> Okay. Yeah. >> And you know the the rights that are read to you? You have the right to remain silent. >> It been so long I forgot. >> Do you understand what it means? >> Uh, no. I really don't to be honest. >> Okay. Well, I'm going to read it to you and we'll go by it bit by bit. Okay. And if you have any questions, I just want you to ask me cuz I want to make sure you understand. >> Um, but these are your constitutional rights, okay? You do have the right to remain silent. Do you understand that? >> Okay. >> It hasn't actually been as long as Thunder is trying to portray. In 2013, he was charged with grand theft. Following that charge, he had several drug violation charges, meaning this is far from his first rodeo. At this point, he knows all the Cowboys by name. Yet still, he continued to post videos of himself smoking on Facebook. >> Are you good with having a conversation about what happened? >> Yes, I am. >> Okay. All right. If you can raise your right hand for me. I am a law enforcement officer in the state of Florida and I have the ability to take sworn testimony in reference to criminal offenses. [music] Do you swear affirm the testimony you're about to give is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. So, help you God. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. Go ahead and put your hand down. So, you know, I have an open mind to things. I would like to just start slow. Um, try and speak up. I know this is hard. I know it's um an emotional situation and I know that what happened is, you know, kind of traumatic. I'm not here to judge you. I'm just here to get [clears throat] well and to get your side of the story, okay? because I'm not going to make an assumption of everything. I only have one version of events in front of [clears throat] me. And you know, talking to Cece and talking to other folks, every person I talk to, I get a little bit more cuz everybody's perception is different. Um, but the one thing that isn't different are the facts, like the evidence, >> you know, that includes a lot of different things. uh physical evidence, fingerprints, DNA, uh you know, videos, stuff like that. None of those things are emotional things. >> Mhm. >> People are emotional things. They bring emotion to the situation. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. So, just to start off kind of simple, um who is CC to you? >> Well, we was just friends, then [snorts] we went to sisters. She told me she had a boyfriend. But I didn't really look at them like that. >> Did you say sisters? >> Sister sisters. Like she I call her my sister. She called her. She sister and brother, but we're not related, >> right? >> Like from God. >> So you're just real close. >> Yeah. Real close. >> Okay. >> But everybody thought we was going together, but it wasn't that type of party like that. >> You You're not in a relationship with her? >> No. I we built a relationship cuz we called each other sister and brother. You know what I'm saying? But as the time went on, you know how as time go on, you start feeling emotions for that person. >> You caught feelings, huh? >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Cuz my mom died a couple months back, so I'm looking for love. And I got out of divorce. >> Okay. >> So, I'm I'm looking for somebody to be my backbone. >> Okay. >> So, how long have you guys been romantically involved, do you think? I want to say at least probably two months cuz we've been talking about good three four good two months. >> So two months romantic and about three or four months >> knowing each other >> knowing each other. So the first couple months it was just friends >> got close brother sister type and then you evolved >> and grew into romance. >> Yes ma'am. >> Okay. How would [snorts] you explain your relationship to be? Would you say that you get along really well? Do you jive good? Do you have um a lot of fights? What's your relationship like with her? >> What? >> Well, we get into it every now and then, but when we do, my best option is to try to walk away cuz I'm not the type of person to put my hands on the female. >> Okay? >> Cuz I know it gets dramatic like and [clears throat] y'all are viable creatures. You know what I'm saying? So when she make me mad or what not, I just hang up on her or I just walk away. Sometimes we'll tussle, but I never hit her. >> What do you mean tussle? >> Like >> that's different for everyone. >> Yeah, like grab her by hands and she'll try to hit me or whatnot and I'll be like chill out cuz I don't want this to go no fault what it is. >> Okay. >> She probably have a little scratches on her hand or whatnot, but it's probably from me trying to grab her. >> Okay. Have you ever Have you ever hit her with your hand? >> No, I never >> in the face or anything like that? Ever pull on her hair? >> No. >> Okay. um ever kind of grab her shoulders and just kind of shake her a little bit. >> Just maybe a little bit probably, but it wasn't I can't like >> You wouldn't describe yourself as being violent towards her. >> I just be like >> heated. >> Yeah. >> Maybe. Does that make sense? >> Like trying to tell her to stop. I don't go no father what it is. >> So once we did that, >> I got violent. >> Well, well, I'm going tell you the whole story. Well, let's like I said, I want to start from the beginning. I don't want to lose anything. Are are we starting on Saturday? >> Yeah, we starting on Saturday. >> All right. Where do you guys live together, by the way? You and Cece? >> I don't have a house to stay nowhere. We was like, she was going motel to motel. I was jumping from house to house to >> usually together. >> Not usually together. She probably pick me up >> or probably will I stay night with her probably one time out the week, but we usually together like that. >> Okay. [snorts] Like I said, we barely get along. Like we got a relationship, but we like when she going to one way. Okay. You go your way and I go my way. >> So you can only do a few hours at a time together before getting at it. >> Mhm. >> You guys kind of irritate each other. >> Sort of. >> Do you think I mean would you describe her to have a hot temper? >> Yes, I will. >> Do you think that you have a hot temper? >> I will set up. >> Okay. Do you feel like you have good control of your temper? >> I do until someone put their hands on me. >> Now, hopefully you know this, but if you've only known a person for 3 months and you're already struggling to spend more than a couple of hours with them without getting into a physical altercation, that may not be the person for you. Especially when that person has another boyfriend who they have been seeing longer. >> All right. So, on Saturday, what was things like between you and Cece? on Saturday. We was we was going through it since Valentine's Day. >> Why? >> Cuz it was something I was supposed to do for her and I never did. And so we went from talking real calm to I went from one of my females houses to get my stuff and now all my stuff, my clothes and stuff are in the back of her car. So I told her to bring me my stuff. She told me that she was going to drop it off at my grandmother's my mother's grave or at the store. >> Which store? >> Jul. >> Okay. >> So, as I got on the phone with her, I hung up after she said that. I was already in the area. I was not with her. >> Where were you at? >> I was What was I coming from? I don't want to make no lie. I was coming from my dad house out of Michigan. He stayed in the old folks home. I was walking back towards Michigan. >> Okay. >> So when I seen her pass me, I was walking towards the store. >> Okay. >> Cuz now I want my stuff, >> right? >> You're playing with my stuff and now you're playing with my life. >> Would were you aggravated at that point? >> I was I was a little aggravated. I was a little >> That makes sense. I would be too. So you saw her was she pulled off in the store at this point? >> I seen her when she was pulled off in the store. I jumped in her back seat through the window. >> Was the window open? >> It was open. >> So, which side of the car behind? >> Driver. >> Okay. Why did you jump in? >> Cuz he tried to leave me. And I I'm trying to catch up with you, but at this time I can't catch up with you. >> And you wanted your stuff? >> Yes. So now I caught up with you. So now I'm in your back seat. Now you don't have no choice but to give me my stuff. So she goes yelling and tell me not to put my hands on her. And I'm not going to touch you. I just want my stuff. So she turns around and try to hit me. So I grabbed the hand >> while she's driving. >> While she's driving. So she turned around and tried to hit me. I grab a hand and she pulled over. >> Where did she pull over at? >> By ALC in front of the church. >> Okay. So which side of the road? On the school side or on the church side? >> On the school side. >> Okay. So on the south side of the road on Michigan. Okay. Gotcha. So once she pulled over, we went to I still had her hands cuz now she got money in her hands. I'm trying to get a couple dollars out of the hands cuz she ain't got my I got to get my stuff. I need for you to give me some money now. >> Was she still sitting in the front seat? >> She was still sitting in the front seat of the car. So by this time once I looked up I seen some dude she was talking to walking down the sidewalk. >> Let me ask you a quick question. When you said that she had money in her hand, did you ask her at any point for money? >> Yeah, I did. I said, "Okay, since you want to give me my stuff, you need to pay me or bring me my stuff." So, cuz I need more stuff. I need more boxes, no tank tops. I ain't got nothing. I'm spend like 3 days ago. >> And how did you know she would be up there again? >> She called me and told me she was going to drop my stuff off at my mother's grave site or at July store. >> And did she mention that she was going there for any other reason? She didn't say none of that. She just said she was going to drop my stuff off. So I went up there. >> Okay. So, okay. You're tussling in the car at this point on the side of the road in front of the school. >> In front of the school. >> And she's in the front seat still. >> She's still in the front seat. >> And you're holding on to her hands trying to keep her from hitting you. Yes. >> And trying to take the money basically cuz you know she wasn't giving the stuff to you. >> She wasn't giving me nothing. >> What happens next? >> From the front. She end up from the front seat to the back seat to where I was. >> She jumped back there or >> she jumped back there. I didn't grab her back there. She jumped back there. >> Okay. >> So, by that time got up by hand. So, I'm looking around seeing all these cars pass by. I said, "You need to stop cuz it going to get worse. Police might pop up." So, I don't want to go to jail for no battery and I don't want you to go to jail. So, therefore, I I let her go and I got the car. >> You got out of the car? >> I got out of the car. >> Which side of the car did you get out of? >> I think I got out of the driver's side. The same side I jumped in the window. The side I got out. >> So the back seat though still. >> Yes, ma'am. >> All right. So you open the door yourself and you let yourself out. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. What happened next? >> Once I get out the car and gets around the car, her so-called boyfriend comes up and I tell him he had nothing to do with this. Before Before I get it out my mouth, the man hit me about three four times. >> How did he hit you? >> Like he hit me in my my face still swoll a little bit and I got knocked in the back of my head. He hit me like powerfully. knocked me down and was on top of me. Still hit me. Once I got up, I spit out blood. He hit me just that hard. >> Okay. >> I was dazed out literally. So, >> did he say anything to you when he was hitting you? >> Once he hit me and stood over me, he said, "I've been wanting you for a long time." >> He said, "I've been wanting you for a long time." >> For a long time. >> And why did he say that to you? >> I don't know. I still don't know to this day. And it freaked me out. >> What does that mean? I when somebody say they want you for a long time, it mean they've been plotting on you for a long time. Like they really want you. >> Had there been any tension between you? >> I don't know this man. I only seen him when I go to your live store. I don't know him from Alan to Eve. >> Okay. Did you know him to be her boyfriend? >> I that I did, but otherwise than that, no. >> Now, if it was a random person attacking Thunder, his confusion at being hit would be warranted. But saying you don't know someone and can't understand why they'd attack you when that someone is the boyfriend of the woman you've been seeing is just a smidge bit dense. Especially when that boyfriend walks up on you hitting their girlfriend in plain view of the rest of the world. What happened here is pretty obvious. Jealousy, rage, and a complete disregard for human life. And yet, in spite of everything else Thunder willingly admits, he seems completely unwilling to acknowledge any of those contributing factors. Was there any jealousy between the two of you about because you know you you go with her and he goes with her? >> I don't have no jealousy between nothing like that. Females are females. You know what I'm saying? >> But she did like whenever you saw him around. There was no looks. There was no words exchanged. Nothing. >> I don't like I told her, I don't like to be around none of that. You going to go around your boyfriend, whatnot, go along. I don't want I don't want to be around that. I don't want to don't rape because my mind is my mama passing and me going through a divorce. >> So would that aggravate you? >> It a little bit. >> Okay, understood. >> You know what I'm saying? >> But in the times that you had seen him before? >> No. >> There had never been any tension? >> Nothing at all. >> He's never said anything to you. Never looked at you crosseyed. >> I mean, he'll probably come up to me and probably a little bit, but be like, >> what does that mean? >> Probably try to touch with me a little bit. stuff that no. [snorts] >> No, I don't because either you guys had either. >> No, we never we never did none of that. But >> never mixed up before. He never came up to you and like said >> nothing like that. >> Yes, he has. >> Okay. Well, tell me about it. >> He came up to me a couple of times was like I want to fight you >> when back probably a week. I like man you mean nothing like that. But I don't know if you were playing or was he serious. >> Did you feel threatened? >> I didn't. things like that. I don't like if you gonna say out your mouth, it's different. You going to say it or do it. >> So he never you never took him seriously. You never felt threatened by him before. >> Never. >> Okay. >> Cuz there's so much other stuff in my mind. I don't >> I be trying to focus on myself. >> Okay. >> I'm only 27 years old. >> So the point is you were never threatened by him before. >> I was never threatened. >> He never felt like he was going to hurt you before. >> No. >> Okay. >> Until he put his hands on me and almost knocked me out and I spit out blood and I don't like to see my own blood. >> Okay. And the only thing that he said to you was what? >> At when he was hitting me. >> Yeah. >> I wanted you. I've been wanting you for a long time. >> Okay. That's all he said to me. >> That's all he said. That's all he said. That's all I remember him saying. >> Okay. What happened next? >> After he hit me and I got up, I tumbled and I spit out blood. I turned around and asked him why did he hit me? He looked at me with this look and went to grab him for something. Well, where was Cece when all that was happening? >> She left. She drove off. Like after I got in the car and after he knock like hitting me in the face and I got up, she got in the car after I got up and was walking off. She got in the car though. >> Did she split you guys up? >> She stopped it cuz he act like he wanted to kill me down there. I'm not going to lie to you. >> He acted like that. >> Yes. Like he didn't want to get from over me. He He didn't want to do none of that. She told him to stop. >> Okay. >> And to get off my brother. >> And he stopped. >> And he stopped. >> Okay. So, at that point, was he walking away back across the road? >> He stopped and stood there >> on the same side of the road. >> On the same side until I got up and walked away and started spitting my blood. >> And then after he stood there on the same side of the road, at what point did he start walking to the other side? after I started to walk off and when she left that's when he started to go on the other side of the road. >> So it was done. [clears throat] >> It was done. >> Okay. So what happened next? >> After that I turned around and asked him why did he hit me? >> Is this after he's walking away? >> He Yeah, he walked away but I turn I I stopped him and asked him why he hit me like that. Now, we don't condone violence here, but it doesn't take a genius to list a good couple of reasons why the victim hit Thunder. Apparently, it does take someone smarter than him, though. >> After I walked across the street, I asked him, "Why did he hit me? What was it for?" He repeated out of his mouth and looked at me, "I been you for a long time. You been on my nerves." And then he went to reaching for something. And I don't know what for. >> Was he facing you completely? >> He was facing me completely. >> So stand up for just a minute. [snorts] If I'm If I'm you and I'm standing here and I'm asking you the question, I want you to stand just like he was standing >> like >> show me how he was standing. All right. So he's And what did he say? >> He's like, I've been with you for a long time. And he's standing like like this. >> And show me what he did. But after I asked him that, he was like, and then he started walking towards me like he wanted to come towards me and hit me again. >> Okay. Did you say anything else to him? >> I didn't say nothing else to him. >> When he >> as he walked towards me, I didn't say nothing else to him. >> Okay. So, what happened next? >> Turned around and walked away. >> No. No. Wait. I didn't hear what you said. What now? >> After after he walked towards me, it was recouper. It was consequences. in recuperation. >> I don't understand. So, you got to you you got to walk me through that part. >> I >> If you're If you're If he's standing there and he's walking towards you. >> Yes. >> Go ahead and stand back up for me. If I We're going to switch roles. I'm him. I'm walking towards you. What did you do? >> Honestly, let me tell you the truth. I I had a gun. I shot him. >> Okay. Where did you have a gun on you? >> I on my side. >> Okay. Do you have like a holster or was in your pocket? It was emotional. >> Okay. Um on the right side. >> On the right side. >> Okay. So, as he's walking towards you, you just did you just pull it out or what happened? >> I had a shirt in my hand. As I spit the blood out, I had a shirt. I been had it. I was thinking as when I got up off the ground, I'm dizzy. I'm tasting blood. Now I spit the blood out. And I see me spit blood three times on the ground. I did not grab him. I c I don't I cocked it back and everything. I thought about it like just walk away. >> Leave it alone. Just walk away. >> So even though you were telling yourself in your mind to walk away, you cocked the gun and you were you angry? >> I was I rate I literally it went from 100 to zero real quick. Like zero to 100 real quick. Like so after I got on the other side, I asked him why he hit me. So, you had the gun out already? >> I've been had it out. >> Okay. So, that's the part that we didn't cover before. Okay. Go ahead and sit back down. So, >> I had it out and the shirt >> was the shirt covering the gun. >> Covered. >> Okay. >> So, I had the shirt like you couldn't see anything. Then I wiped my face with the shirt and the gun. >> So, as I walked toward, I asked him, "Why'd you hit me?" And he like he was standing. He stood there though like I've been with you for a long time. You walked towards me and I felt thirsty. >> Okay. And when he walked towards you, I know this is the hard part. Did you just raise the gun up? What did you do next? >> I raised it up. The first shot missed him cuz I aimed for his head. The next one caught him in the chest. >> Okay. Where did it hit him in the chest? If you want to point on yourself. >> This side. >> On that side. >> I seen it. Hit him right in the chest. I don't know where the other ones hit him at cuz I turned around. I ran. >> How many times did you fire at him? >> The gun hold six shots. I literally emptied the whole clip. >> What kind of gun is it? >> If I'm not mistaken, I think it was a a nine or 380. >> What color? >> Black. Okay. Where is the gun now? >> As I I got in fear. I can't even tell you. I lost it. I It might be in the water somewhere. >> What water? >> Cuz as I took off, I threw it like where the Zado at. >> Mhm. >> The little lake in >> Zapato. The ditch. >> I got rid of it. And uh >> you threw it in there. >> I got rid of it. >> Did you throw it in there? >> I got rid of it. Yes. >> Okay. So, I'm going to see if you're willing. I'll drive you out there if you'll show me about where you tossed it. Cuz I'll tell you this, that little ditch area does dry up and I don't need a child going over there finding that gun. You feel what I'm saying? >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. And what happened happened? We can't change it. And I think it's important to not leave a gun out there. You don't even know if it hit the water or not. >> I don't even know where it went cuz as I threw it, I just threw it when I was running. >> But you're telling me the truth. That's where you threw it. >> Yes. >> And are you willing to show me where? >> I willing to show you where, but I'm not I don't know if it went in the water or in the bushes over there. >> Yeah. Okay. And that's even more important. So like a kid could be cutting through there. Anybody could be cutting through there and pick it up if it especially if it didn't go in the water. So that's important to me. Okay. It's actually a bit refreshing to hear someone completely admit to what they've done. No real theatrics, minimal woe is me, just cold, hard facts. But when you hear what was left at the scene, it becomes clear that his reason for being so forthcoming might not be out of the goodness of his heart. It might just be because he made a big big oopsie. [snorts] >> All right. So, [sighs and gasps] there's a couple things I want to kind of go over with you cuz again, >> in the process of the thing going on, the reason why I called my sister, told everybody that I wanted to, you know what I'm saying? I lost my phone. >> You lost your phone? >> I lost my phone. >> Where did you lose your phone? >> At the incident. >> At the incident. Okay. Do you know about where you lost it at? >> No, I don't. >> Okay. Well, I have a couple things I want to show you and I just want to ask you. Um, these aren't tricks. This is going to be picture number two. Who is this? >> Yeah. >> Who's that? >> That's me. >> That's you. Is that you on Saturday? So, these are the light shorts. >> The white shirt. >> The white shirt you had on your head. You had a gray shirt like that. Is that the same gray shirt you're wearing? >> Yes, it is. >> I'm going to have to collect that. All right. So, that's you from the back as you're walking towards her car. We just zoomed in so you could see it. Okay. Um, and this is going to be photograph number one. Is Is that also you? >> Mhm. [clears throat] >> Same person. >> Yes. Okay. All right. I just wanted to make sure and verify this is that you agree that this is you. >> That's me. >> Okay. And what is that in your back pocket right there? >> That's my phone. >> That's your phone. What kind of phone is that? >> It's a iPhone 6 Plus. >> iPhone 6 Plus. >> See, I lost it. >> That's your iPhone 6 Plus right there. Now, uh this is like a camouflage with a orange accent. That's the back of the phone. When you flip it around, what color is it? It's It got a broke screen on it. >> No, I mean like the case. What color is it? >> The case is black on the inside >> with that orange detail. Is that accurate? >> Yeah. Right down right there. >> So, this phone right here that we found within probably about I don't know approximately 10 phone that fell out of your pocket. Is that correct? >> Yes. Footage from a nearby gas station not only showed Thunder getting into CC's car with the iPhone found at the scene of the crime in his back pocket, it showed him chasing after the vehicle and launching himself in through the window, clearly enraged as Cece tried to drive away. >> So, I know that things escalated when you said things went from zero to 100 and you were angry. I get it. There's a lot of eyes out there. There's a lot of people watching it. Nobody wants to get, pardon my language. Nobody wants to feel demeaned or embarrassed. Nobody does. I can sympathize with how you felt because I I'm human. You're human >> and nobody wrote up. >> No. Right. Everybody Everybody has feelings and feelings. >> So I would have felt humiliated. Would you do you think it's fair to say that you felt humiliated by that? >> I would say that, but then again, I would say I felt threatened for my life. >> Do you did you feel angry? >> I felt angry, too. >> You You described it. I saw red. That's what you said. Okay. >> I was angry and I feel threatened for my life. I really did. >> I'm not going to lie to you. >> No, I And I don't I believe that's what you're saying. And I had to look at the whole picture again. And when you were on this side of the road after she after Cece broke it up, he did stop. Is that correct? >> Yeah, he stopped. >> And he walked to this side of the road. >> That's correct. I want to make sure I'm being accurate. Okay. That's why I'm repeating this to you. >> And you got up and you had the shirt in your hand and you said that you pulled the gun from your side and had the shirt covering the gun. Is that correct? Okay. So, as you're walking across the street towards him to ask him, "Hey, man, why why did you punch me? Why are you hitting me? You already had the gun out at that point. >> I already had it in my hand." >> Okay. And he turned around and was kind of a guess and said, >> "You know, I've been wanting to do that for >> a long time. >> A while. You get on my nerves." That's what you said. >> Pretty much. >> And he was facing you at that point. >> He was coming towards me again. If you were so scared, I have to ask you, the fight had been done. Why did you walk across the road at that point to reinitiate contact with him? >> I felt like if it if I wouldn't probably try to defend myself then or probably tried to stand my ground with him, it would have happened again. So, and I'm repeating this again so I make sure I'm understanding accurately. Okay. You felt that if you didn't stand up to him at that point, >> it would happen again. >> That he would be he would run all over you anytime he saw you. >> Yes. >> Okay. So, you felt that if I don't if I basically take it like you know it then he's going to come at me again. If I let him win this fight right now, I got to handle this now or he's going to beat me up again down the road. Is that correct? >> That's pretty much how I see it. >> Okay. >> Do you think that that was the the best idea? >> No. >> Okay. >> I kind of feel like I could have just walked away. Just let it be. By going to be by gun. >> Do you believe that he would be alive today if you would have walked away from that situation? >> I honestly don't think so. >> You don't think he would be? >> No. >> Why not? cuz it's um let me put it like this. It's a couple people in the world. If I tell them somebody put their hands on me and they made me bleed, they're going to react. >> Okay. I guess that's you answered my question fairly. So, I'm going to ask that same question but in a different way cuz I more specifically. Do you think that if you had not chosen to confront him again in that moment? >> Mhm. >> It would never have escalated again. Do you think he would still be alive today? If you walked away from that, and I'm if he died by somebody else's hands, that's that has nothing to do with you. No. >> But if you walked away, you were angry. You were seeing red. Was it a good idea to walk across the street to somebody that you just admitted you're afraid of? But at that moment, it was an anger thing and you didn't want him to clown you. He just got done essentially kicking your a whole bunch of people. You had to go back over there and stand up to him because if he didn't, then it's been established that he has the permission in the ways of the streets, I guess. Is that correct? >> Yeah. I'm not. >> No, I'm just saying. >> Okay. I'm just >> I want to make sure I'm I'm understanding what your thought process was. Okay. >> Although I'm not telling you to be wrong, to feel that way, I have to really evaluate the law with stand your ground. The the the threat to you at that point was gone. He was walking away from you. And I'm trying. You were angry just like you said. and you had every right to be angry. And you admit, and I agree with you, it was a bad choice to walk across the street because you actually walked across the street at that point with an unfair advantage being a gun. You couldn't beat him with your fist. He's a big guy. >> He's very big. And I'm not that's that's not saying anything that is less of you at all because I could be I mean I'm pretty tall and I I'm not going to claim to be very strong or anything like that, but he's a big dude. I wouldn't be picking a fight with that guy. It wouldn't be a fair match, right? >> No, it wouldn't. >> Okay. So, you and him not a fair match. And it does come across a little bit that your anger got the best of you and you had that courage to go back and confront him because you had a firearm. It's not it's not a very good thing to say I was scared for my life, but then I initiated a confrontation again. Does that make sense? >> Just a little bit. >> I'm just trying to explain to you how I how I have to assess everything. I'm being fair and honest with you cuz you've been honest with me >> at this point. A self-defense claim is out of the window, but Thunder seems to realize that storm is brewing, so he changes his story. Unfortunately for him, it's a little late for that. >> Had he said anything that I missed because at no point did he say anything to you about having a gun? At no point did he say anything to you about shooting you. Is that correct? >> He been told me he was going to kill me. >> He never told me that. He he been told me he was going to kill me. But I ain't >> When did that happen? >> When he was beating me up, he said he was he tied me and he was going to kill me right there on the ground. So as Cece broke, CeCe is the one that stopped it. Like saved my life. Honestly, if I would have been still down there, he would have literally I would have died right there. So, when you and Cece were tustling in the car and other people >> seen it, >> how do you think that looked to everyone else? >> Like I was probably beating her up. >> You said that yourself to Cece in the car. You said, "We better stop cuz we don't want to get arrested." >> Mhm. >> Okay. So, with that thought in your mind, looking back on everything, >> did it occur to you that he may have thought you were beating her? That's what I'm saying. That's what I told her. I got out of the car, said, "Let's stop cuz he coming down the sidewalk. I don't want to get into it with him, >> right?" >> So, I'm get out and leave. So, I got out the car. As I realized I ain't have my shirt, I walked around the car, try to get my shirt out of the car. >> Was the gun in the shirt or was it still on you? >> It was got it from up the car. >> The gun was in the car. >> Yes. Where was it? In the car. >> When I grabbed the shirt, it was under the shirt. I grabbed it from out the car. >> Okay. Where was the shirt in the car? >> The shirt was in the back seat. >> So when you saw >> you you picked it up out the car? >> Yes. Cuz I didn't have it on me. Then I got it and I put it on me. Once I grabbed it and put it on me and grabbed my shirt. He I don't even know how close. I don't know if he ran to me cuz he was a distance away from me. I had time to grab my shirt to leave. time. Grab my shirt and turn around. I was he >> You mean grab your shirt, put the gun on, turn around and walk, and then then he's there. You had enough time to do all of that before he walked up on me? >> He got up on me and hit me. >> Okay, that's that seems like a lot of time. >> That That is So once I turned around and got ready to walk away, he hit me and I hit the ground. Then he hit me again and hit me again. He hit me again. By this time, I'm covering my face and I'm face down. Now he hit me from the back of the head. I still got knots in the back of my head from where he hit me. Like my whole it was full, >> right? >> So now I'm thinking to myself, you really going to kill me down here. CeCe, she jumped on me and stopped it and told him to stop hitting me. >> I understood, but you went through that part of the story three times and until just now, you never said that he told you he was going to kill you. In fact, you were very clear about the fact that he said, "I've been wanting to." >> I'm still trying to remember the things he said because he been beating on me. I didn't been to sleep these last two days trying to get rid of this headache on my head. >> Did you ever go to the hospital? >> No, I have not been to the hospital. None of that. as he hit. I only know where the blood came from. I probably have a blood clot in my head or something. He >> Well, you said you spit it out, so >> I spitted it out. >> Maybe you have a cut in your mouth. >> No, no cut in my mouth. None of that. >> You don't have anything on your face? >> He hit me from here until the back of my head and all. >> Okay. But me, I'm just saying >> I covered my face. I was head down like this on the ground. >> But he hit you in your face on your face. >> Here. He connected here. >> Okay. >> He connected here. >> Uh-huh. >> And he also connected over here. Do you can you point any bruises that you have? >> One right >> on your face? >> No, I can't. >> Right here. My ear is swoll, but there's no no >> I'm gonna take pictures of everything. Very close. Very thorough pictures. Is that good? >> Okay. Cuz he hit me from here. >> But there's no You You're telling me that there's no bruises? >> There's really no bruises, but he hit me from here. Okay. >> And this whole It was out to about right here. >> Okay. It looks right now like it's it's pretty, you know, even. And it looks the same as the other one, but I'm going to take close pictures to really capture it to make sure. >> And from >> Well, can you part your hair for me right there? And I can take a look to see if there's a a bump >> somewhere along here. >> Okay. I don't see anything, but I'm going to take pictures of all that, too. Okay. >> And over here. >> Okay. Um, and you're sure that when you fired at him that he was shot in the front of him? >> Yes. >> Each shot was in the front of him? >> Yes. >> Okay. So, he you're absolutely sure there's no possible way that there would be a shot in back. >> Not that. No, >> cuz he was facing me like he was coming toward like I said, he was coming towards me like he was grabbing for something. So I didn't even know cuz as [snorts] me asking him the question he's walking towards me with his look on his face like he grabbing for something like he okay I know heard what you want. >> The look on the face has [snorts] nothing to do with what his hands are doing. >> Yes. >> So show me what his hands were doing that made you think he was grabbing for something. >> He had his hand in his pocket like >> walking towards me. >> Okay. >> So I was I don't even >> At any point did he make a mention of a gun? >> Something to you. Huh? >> You said I was going to kill you right there on that side. As I walked towards him, asked him why he hit me. He said I wanted to kill you. >> You said that I've been wanting you for a while. You've been getting on my nerves before. >> That's what I'm saying. >> So now he said he he wanted to kill you. >> He wanted me for a while. I've been getting on your nerves. And as I walked towards him, asked him why' he hit me in my face. Why'd he hit me like that? >> But you never said that before. >> That's what I'm telling you. >> Okay. >> I'm remembering these things just now. This stuff is just not coming back to me. >> Okay. I walked up to him. That's why he hit me. He said, "I've been wanting for a long time. I really tried to kill you." That's the words came out of his mouth. I really tried to kill you. >> So, a guy that's never like had any issue, has never like done anything to you before. He >> guess he felt I was out of place for wrestling with his girlfriend and felt that he got disabled. That's basically what it looked like to me. Miraculously, Thunder finally comes to the conclusion of a possible motive for the victim confronting him. Of course, this is only once the detective has poked multiple flaws in his story of self-defense. Because if someone threatened to kill me, you can bet that would be the first thing I would mention to the police. >> Do you really feel from the bottom of your soul and thinking of everything because there's a life lost at this point? You know what I mean? There's people that love that man the way your family loves you. So, they're suffering a loss. Nobody wins in this situation. Do you agree with me? Okay. You're a human and I'm not judging. That's not my role. But it is hard for me to understand because at the point that you walked across that street towards him, you became the aggressor. You became the one that initiated that contact with him and that was a bad idea and you agree with that. >> Yeah. >> That was a bad choice because you were seeing red, right? >> I was upset. It was a lot of things with my mom. >> Yes. You were angry. You were embarrassed. I'm >> still going through the emotional crisis about my divorce and my mom. You have other turmoil in your life and you did make a conscious effort before walking across that street to arm yourself with a gun. So you knew that that gun cause trouble >> was going to cause trouble. So I want you to really search your soul for a moment and truly think about the difference between protecting yourself because you absolutely had to because in this situation, my dear, you you initiated that contact again with him. He had walked away from you. He might be okay. I'm not saying that he isn't, but I'm saying to you and I'm asking you by everything that we've just discussed, I cannot honestly agree that he posed imminent threat to your life at that moment because you reapproached him. And I want you to look me in the eye because I'm being respectful and I'm I'm telling you the truth from everything and I've repeated it back to you to make sure I'm getting it right. But for his family and for anybody else listening, it's going to be hard for anybody to think that you actually feel badly about it. >> I really I kind of do. >> You kind of do. >> I really do. I could have walked away, but at the same time, it could have been me or him cuz he lived the same life I live. >> Like >> you live any life you choose to live. >> Yes. But he, like I said, I I felt threatened. I It might seem like I didn't, but I did. >> I believe you felt threatened. But the difference >> between >> the law in the streets, I understand holding your ground in the streets when someone swings on you in front of an audience. You got to stand up and you either fight, you fight it out like men. But the problem is you didn't go back and finish the fight. You went back and you executed somebody that wasn't a fair fight. You didn't fight them fist to fist. You're entitled and you're un I understand why you were angry. But you walked back to that man in a situation that was already heated. You're not afraid anymore because you knew what >> was wrong. >> You knew you had a gun. And you know what? He never said to you anything about shooting you, the man with his hands. And he walked away when he was told to stop. He didn't come back and tried to continue. >> He did. He really did. >> But he did. That's not what you said. >> I know. I'm I'm telling you, the man didn't be I done been to so much stuff in my life. Like you got your own life. I got my own life. I've done been so much things and stuff in my life. My head is messed up. Okay, >> I understand that. But in this moment, in the pain that you have, and if your mama were here, cuz I have a mom of three, and if my son were sitting across from me, I would say to my son, "You made a bad decision. You allowed your anger to get the best of you. [snorts] You're not a bad person. You're not an evil person, but you cannot remove the fact that the choice you made to re-engage him. You became the aggressor at that point. You, the threat was gone. He was walking away from you, but you were pissed and you had a gun. And that combination, that combination drove you across the street and started up with him again. You know what I'm saying? If that didn't happen, you would not be responsible for his death. But that's what happened. You did shoot him. You didn't have to shoot him because you didn't have to walk across that road. You started that altercation right back up again. You can't say that you're afraid for your life and also say that you're walking towards the man. If you're afraid, you're going that way. >> I went that way. >> You're walking away from him. He didn't follow after you and said, "I'm going to make you come back here and drag you back." You didn't do that. Remember, there's people watching this. There's cameras out there. And I know and I respect that you were scared in the moment where you were getting beat up, but it was done. Once that stopped, your life is no longer in danger. And you can't go back across the street and start it back up again after you have the upper the secret upper hand of a gun hidden in a shirt and say that you're scared for your life. You can't say that. You have to admit the truth, which is I was angry. And in the streets where I live, your pride and the way you carry yourself is what gets you by. True or false? >> No, cuz I usually walk away from my situation. >> But you didn't. I'm not talking about what you usually do. You were upset. You were sad. You have a lot of things that have happened in your life and all of that contributes to it. But in that moment, you weren't scared for your life. You were angry and you had a gun. >> I was scared. I actually was scared. >> Then why go back towards him? >> I didn't know what he was capable of doing after that. The man beating me up and I spit blood. I I don't know what the man capable of doing after that. What he was capable of doing was walk and that's what he was doing. >> And the day was still young, >> dude. [snorts and clears throat] In that moment, he was not causing you a threat of your life, >> man. Threatened me. He really did. >> He beat you up >> and he threatened me. He threatened my life >> when you walked back across the street with a gun. >> He threatened me before I even did anything. The man beat me up, threatened me on the ground, and threatened me as I came towards him. as you came towards him. Bingo. >> We'd be remiss not to give props to this detective. Not only does she get all the answers from Thunder, but she's able to call out his BS and give him the tough parenting that he clearly needs. Yet, it seems that he's still unable to take responsibility for his actions. >> All cuz I want my stuff. This [ __ ] happened all cuz I was trying to get my stuff from Cece. This stuff happened. Everything happened because of this. >> Your anger started with her and it boiled >> escalated to somebody else. It did. It did. >> And you're human for that. [snorts] Are you considered to be um Did you register as a felon? >> Why did you have a gun that day? >> I didn't car. >> Well, I didn't have it on me at all. >> Well, where did the gun come from? Does it belong to Cece or you don't want to go there? >> I really don't. >> Okay. [snorts] Is it fair to say that it doesn't belong to her? She doesn't carry it? >> Yes, it is. >> Okay. So then the only other person in that car was you. Does the Is that a gun that you normally carry? >> No. >> Why did you have it that day? >> That's what I'm saying. I I seen it in the back seat and I grabbed it with shirt. I didn't. This don't belong to me. It's not mine. I don't own it. I ain't pay for it. None of that. >> Did you borrow it? >> I didn't borrow it. That's what I'm saying. I jumped in the backseat of the car. I don't know what's back though. >> Okay. >> So, when I jump in the back seat, I said I'm seeing clothes and all this other stuff backed up. >> Well, you said it was your stuff that was back there. >> It was new stuff backed up. My stuff is in her trunk. My clothes. >> Okay. Maybe I misunderstood. I'm glad you clarified for me. >> Except as the detective is fully aware, the only thing Thunder is clarifying here is that he's a liar. A quick look on his Facebook profile shows a photo of him with a gun tucked into his pants. A friend even commented, "If you don't take that small pistol off your effing hip, not really a good look when you're a convicted felon." >> What do you think should happen at this point? >> All I don't know is what can do. >> If this were your family member that was that was killed, same situation. What do you think should happen? Honestly, what would you feel would be the correct outcome? >> I don't know. I'm telling you the truth. Free kids out here. >> Okay. >> I don't. >> Okay. I'll get you some issues. Okay. All right. Just tight for me. If you need something, just holler out and someone will be here in a second. I'm going to come back. I just have to look through a couple things. and I will be back. Okay. Ultimately, Thunder managed to receive just 25 years in prison on charges of secondderee murder with a firearm. He is set to be released in 2024 when he will be 53 years old. His victim's identity has remained under wraps due to Marcy's law, which allows a victim's name to be protected following a crime. Thank you for watching today's video. Whether you're new here or have been with us for a while, check out one of the craziest cases I've ever covered right here or one of my newest uploads right here.