I wish Levi wish he had a different father. I wish your first wife wish he had a different husband. She'd be alive now and Levi be alive now. >> I did not kill him. You killed him. >> No, I didn't. Oh, you killed him. >> Meet the world's most terrible husband and father, Carl Carlson. Because this man is responsible for murdering both his son and his wife. Crimes he thinks he can get away with. >> He didn't kill him. Okay, let's get that straight. I did not kill him. And after 30 years of hiding these horrific murders, Carl's lies will begin to fail him as he realizes his actions have consequences. This is about ready to end. But it's not going to end well for you. Let's stop. Take the mask off. Okay. Take off the mask. >> You're his biological father and you don't give him help. What kind of father are you? >> Exactly. On November 20th, 2008, police in rural New York received a heartbreaking 911 call. >> 911, what's location of your emergency? >> Yes, I live at >> Okay. >> I think I need an ambulance. >> Ma'am, what's going on? >> The truck fell on my stepson. >> The truck fell on your stepson? >> We just [laughter] got home and I don't think he's alive. >> His chest is >> His chest is >> No. Oh my god. You've just heard the voice of Cindy Best, the wife of Carl Carlson and the stepmother of 23-year-old Levi Carlson. When Synica County Sheriff's Office responded to her panicked call, they walked into a disturbing scene. In a garage on Cindy and Carl's farm, they discovered the body of Levi. It appeared that while he was working beneath an old farm truck, the jack holding it up fell and he was crushed beneath the immense weight. Initially, police believed it had been a freak accident, nothing more than a tragedy. But it wasn't the first unusual tragedy in Carl's life. About 20 years prior, in 1991, Carl's first wife, Christine Carlson, perished [music] in a house fire. She had been trapped inside a bathroom with a boarded up window that made it impossible for her to escape. One strange death from a horrible accident is [music] one thing, but two, both of which occurred when Carl Carlson was the only person present. That's no accident. And neither were the life insurance policies that were put on both Levi and Christine just weeks before their deaths, both of which named Carl as the beneficiary and totaled nearly a million dollars. Within a 30-year span, he became a millionaire off of the tragic violent deaths of his loved ones. And though he had gotten away with it for three decades, Levi's death changed that because behind the scenes, Carl's new wife was beginning to doubt that either of the deaths were an accident. In 2012, she spoke with authorities, offering to wear a wire in order to get a confession from her husband. At the time, [music] the two were separated. She told Carl that if he told her the truth about Levi's death, [music] she would be willing to rekindle their romance. I asked you if you pushed the truck and you said yes. >> I didn't push the truck. I said no. I said I had nothing to do. But I said I took advantage of the situation once it happened. And that is exactly what it said. >> Carl, you told me that you didn't set it up that way, but when you were in there, you saw the opportunity after it happened. and Carl took the bait, leading to him being taken into custody just days later. At this [music] point, Carl has no idea that his wife recorded his confession, and no idea that police are looking at him for not just one murder, but two. And finally, police were about to have answers nearly three decades later. Tell me again the true events of how it came about that Levi was coming over to your house that day and what happened [clears throat] when he got there. >> He made plans like he always does. He asked me if he could come over to work on his truck. >> He went he called you from his cell phone or his >> No, from his wherever. >> He called your home phone or your cell phone? >> He he finally got a cell phone. I I never got a cell phone till just a little bit ago. >> So he called your home phone. >> Yep. And >> and talked to you the day of the day of his death. No, it was before then it worked and stuff and >> um said that geez um because I told him he was he's already been helping me on the truck, >> you know, it wasn't just a fivem minute job. It's he's been >> he's been working on your truck. >> And I said, well, I got the hydraulic line. >> Let's back up a thing. He called wanted to work on his truck, you said. >> Well, his truck, too. He >> was what was his truck? >> He had a pickup and he had brake problems or calipers or something. >> So, he wanted to come over to your house to work on his brakes >> and my truck. So he was going to work on mine for a while with me because I had to go away. >> Why would he want to come over your house, work on your truck? >> Because he gets money. >> Oh, so you offered to pay him. >> Well, I always slept him a little. He knew it. >> Okay. >> So, and we were getting along then. >> So, he was going to work on his truck. >> He was going to work on mine for a while, >> but he had to finish your truck before he could get to his truck or what? >> No, he he worked on my truck and then when I left, he was going to work on his. >> Did you tell him when to come over? Um, I said, 'Well, why don't you come on over in the morning and we'll work on my truck and then you can work on yours when I leave or whatever. Fine. And he'd been over before. We were take taking the hydraulic lines and the transmission lines out of the truck and the power steering pump because the pump was bad. >> So, you're going to put a new pump in. >> Yeah, cuz it was a hydraulic pump for a snow plow and every time you put any pressure, it blew the lines. No, it was an old >> You grew up on farm, right? >> Yeah. >> You worked on machinery? >> Everything. >> Me, too. I worked on cars, tractors, >> and it was just >> we No, we you don't pay for anything. You fix it all, right? >> You can't you can't afford it. And plus, it's just what we did. >> My farm was my grandfather's. I think some of what you're going to be telling me is we always jacked everything. We had a big we had a big old railroad jack >> cuz my grandfather's railroad. >> That's what we had. >> And every farm had a railroad freaking railroad jack. It weighed about 80 pounds. >> They can lift the house up. >> They can lift the house, but they were as stable as [ __ ] >> right? >> How many times did yours tip over? Uh, I think like most farmers that we all and we once we jacked it up, we blocked it with big wood blocks >> when you could find them. >> The blocks that police are referring to would have been worth finding because the truck which weighed thousands of pounds was being held up by one of these, just one. And though farmers aren't usually ones for OSHA regulations, most would have a better jack or system for raising up their trucks. But in this case, he offered his son the railroad jack without any blocks or additional safety measures. Essentially, he was looneying his son with one of these. One wrong move, one shift, and he would be dead. But he didn't stop at just sending his son beneath the death trap. Police believe fully that he was the one who triggered it. >> So, what happens? You go inside to take a shower. So, I go in and take a shower, everything. And uh like I told the officers, and uh is that when I come back, uh the wife and I, we left the house. She went to the car. I said, "I'm going to go in, talk to Levi for a minute, and I had money for her." >> So, you told Cindy you were going to go talk and you were Did you tell Cindy? >> Yeah. No, I didn't tell her. I never told her. >> So, how much were we going to give? >> 50 bucks. >> 50 bucks. It's whatever I had on me, right? >> You know, I mean, >> just help him out a little bit. >> Yeah. I mean, even though he's working, he still it's like, come on, it's my truck. My dad used to do it when we got grown up. If you come over and help him, he'd give you a 20 or say, "Hey, go over to gas tank and fill your truck up." >> I understand. >> You know what it is. >> So, before noon, you went back out or was it afternoon that he went? >> It was before noon. And um I went >> How were you dressed? Soon. >> Taco. Oh, yeah. Okay. >> And we were holding a funeral. And um so I was all dressed up, fancy shoes, pants, tie, the whole nine yards. And like I told them, you know, I went out and they were the first two guys I told is that the truck had already had fallen over and I found him dead. And >> so this was around noon. You found around noon or just before noon you found you went out there and the truck was rolled over on >> Yeah. And I I don't know. So you you panicked in what regard? >> Just I left. >> Now you saw him. Did you run over and call medical help? Call 911 to get home? >> I didn't know. >> Now was there a phone in the garage or a cell phone or you run back to the house and called 911? >> I I went to the funeral. >> So you went So you saw his body on? >> Yep. >> Or you didn't know he was dead for sure? >> I pretty much knew he was dead. >> But you didn't check to make sure you didn't check. >> No, I touched his leg. >> But you didn't check his pulse. So they didn't pulse. cuz it was way >> and you didn't jack the truck up off him at that point. The truck was tipped over on him. >> So you panicked and of course when after you panic, >> what did you do? >> Left. >> When you say left, you left. You didn't jack the truck up and you didn't check a >> I left. >> So you left went where? >> To the car. >> Where was your wife at? The car. >> Okay. And you got in the car with her >> and then >> did you tell her anything? >> I could I I >> You were shocked. I was like >> in such shock that you couldn't tell your wife that your son was crushed. >> I just >> Did you want to check to see a pulse? >> I grabbed his leg and I knew he was dead. I mean >> by grabbing his legs. >> It's just I knew I just >> instinctively >> you live on a farm. >> Was the ice cold at that point? >> He was the legs were blue. >> He has shorts on. >> No pants with no socks. >> And how long were you in the house for? Like 5 minutes? >> I was in the house for an hour. >> Okay. So he's you think he's dead. You get in the car with your wife. >> Left. I was >> When you say left, what do you mean left? >> We left. We drove down the road, went to the funeral. 4 and my wife's family member died. >> Where was the funeral? >> Over in somewhere. >> So how far of a drive from your house? >> Well, we we were gone four and a half hours. >> So you're gone four and a half hours. >> Well, four and a half to five hours. >> And then what did you do when you got back? >> When I got home, I went to the garage. >> And what did you do? I mean, you already know he's not going to be alive. knew, but it was like, >> you think he was going to come back to life? >> Maybe. I don't know. I don't know. >> Okay. >> And then all of a sudden, it's like I jacked it up, pulled him out, and when I seen his face, it was like the switch turned on to reality. >> So that switch was off for four and a half hours. >> Yeah. I mean, do you you understand? >> Now, why when you came back, did you >> have you jacked up the Did you jack the car up? Did you use the railroad jack? >> So you use the jack up and then you did what with his body? >> Pulled it out. >> And his body had been for like four and a half hours, >> five hours, whatever. Whatever time. >> And what did you do to him when you took him out? >> Did you hug him? >> Oh yeah. I laid right with him and cried like a baby. >> And then at what point, how long did you lay there? >> I Well, as soon as I pulled him out, it really when I seen his face, it clicked >> that he's dead. >> Ran to the house and I don't run. >> So you jacked it up. got him out and then realized. >> Let's go. You jack up the jack up. >> How did you make sure it wasn't going to fall over again? >> I just pulled him out. I mean, it was just pull him out. >> Did you put the jack back down? >> I didn't know. I didn't give a [ __ ] about the truck. >> So, did it was up on a jack or ever more then? You didn't block it up or do anything? >> No. No. >> You just sit on that railroad jacket. >> I mean, >> you pull his body out, leave it right there. >> Run in the house or beat on the door. Told her I come out. She >> You were shocked. He was just found dead. You actually found that 4 and a half hours. >> Yeah. Well, I was shocked when I seen his face. >> He was actually dead. >> Yeah. It's like this can't be happening. This can't be. I mean, like I told them, I'm not going to make any excuse that I was on a shitload of drugs. I've been on drugs for a long time and a lot of them. I mean, >> so what does happen then when you go back in the house? I went to the house to the door, yelled at her and came back. >> And what did you tell her? >> I said, "Call 911." Levi was under the truck, pinned, I think. Something to that effect. >> And then you ran back. >> Come back. And I looked under his shirt and looked him over and I baldled like a >> about what? >> My son's dead. And for some reason, I could just set it back there for those hours and just stare at the wall. >> Levi was Carl's only son. No parent can possibly imagine doing this to their child. But Carl was far from most parents. Levi actually had moved out of his parents house when he was just 16 years old, and for good reason. His childhood was full of physical and emotional violence. At 15, Levi called police to file a report about his father, stating that his dad had beat him over the head. During the altercation, his dad reportedly asked him, [music] "Do you want to die?" A man willing to do that so unashamedly and repeatedly is a man capable of anything. >> What were you afraid of? >> I don't know. I don't know. I just locked up. I >> I've made a lot of mistakes in my life. Probably we >> This is No, this isn't a mistake. This is the worst, you know, and I know that there's that saying, "Oh, there's more to it." There's not. How can you your kid? He's come for the [ __ ] >> Because you know what Levi was like? >> Yeah, but at this time in his life, he was great. >> Oh, you knew when Levi was like >> I knew what he was like, but >> No, you know what he did to your grand >> I did not. >> I think >> I did not. Not at all. >> Let me tell you something, Carl. I'm going to set this right here. You know this this this is a what they call a thumb drive. I don't know how to computer. This is what we can record audio, video, and so forth with. And I know, and we will, and I I will tell you 100% truth. I will play for you the audio of you telling what happened. I don't think the only thing you didn't do is you didn't tell Cindy everything you knew about Levi. >> So, I don't think >> I never knew that. I never knew You did you but you did not know. I know without question you did not know. You were concerned about being that Cindy was doing something. >> You were concerned that Cindy was not being honest with you when she knew she wasn't. >> Oh yes. No. >> Oh no. I I told neighbors. I told friends. I told you >> my neighbors lab down. >> When did you tell them that? >> Weeks when Cindy first said started into this. I told my daughter. She's a cop. And I'm like, >> "What did you call send?" >> I'm like, at first I'm like, "Tell you what." And I said over and over, "No, I did not kill." I says, I says, "You're trying to, you know, she wouldn't say, you know, she was smart. She never played the fact. You didn't say that you are." >> Carl, let's not blend this on here. >> I'm not. No, I'm just listen. You can either listen. >> I'm not looking Look for a jury's eyes. >> Oh, I know. You simply made a m whe judgment call about do you think anybody is going to believe that you saw this on there? >> Would you mind if I just stand up again please? >> Just listen to me one second. Let me just get through this. You didn't feel the need at that point in time in your life to call because you knew that that Levi's death was he was better off as you said dead than alive? >> No. Not dead. >> You think he was better off alive? >> He was really coming around. the kid that I knew. >> Well, >> my wife will tell you. I mean, he >> Let's go over Let's go over Let's play the audio tape of you and sing. >> No, I know it. We don't. >> No, I think we really should play it because I think you need to clarify some things for us. >> Otherwise, we're all going to have a really >> a misunderstanding of what happened. >> I mean, look, can I >> You you have a chance. I really >> take my hand on a second. >> You've dug this hole, Carl. I'm here. I can feel your hand shaking. >> My My handy shakes. >> No, I want you right out. I'm I'm here pulling out. You You got a little hole dug here. A big hole. I'm here pulling. I'm going Carl, listen. There's a reason why. There is a reason why that you and me are sitting here. >> Oh, I agree. I agree. >> It's not just because of Sydney. It's because that that accident, that death to your son is why we're both sitting here right now. >> That insurance policy is why we're here. That fire is why we're here. >> Oh, well, I I I'm sorry. What are you sorry about? >> I'm sorry that everybody's here for this when I understand with with Levi. >> I I want to I want to have the investigators bring our audio record if I stand. I really I'm >> Please stand up. >> You do not know how bad this is. >> While you stand up, I want to get I want to talk to the investigator and find out some information. >> This is where Carl starts to sweat. He had no idea that police were even aware of the incident that happened over 20 years ago. In 1991, Carl was married to and lived with Christina Carlson in Murphy's, California, a small mining town. There, they welcomed their three kids into the world, including Levi. But when Levi was 5, tragedy struck. It was New Year's Day. Carl claimed that as he was working in the detached garage about 600 ft from the family home, he heard screaming. He ran outside to discover that the home was filling up with smoke as flames licked out of the windows. In his initial report to police, Carl stated that he could hear his wife, who had been taking a bath, screaming at him to save the children. He went window to window, grabbing each of his three kids to save their lives. But by the time he got them out, it was too late for Christina. The bathroom she was in had only a single window, one that was boarded up by plywood that had been nailed into the window frame with 17 nails. There, alone on the floor, she suffocated and died of smoke inhalation as her husband and kids stood outside watching their house burn. >> Let's look at the tail of everything. >> Yeah. >> Let's look at the the house fire where your wife was dies and the the windows boarded up days beforehand. You told the investigators here earlier that it was eight months ago that you boarded that window up in that bathroom prior to the fire. Eight months. You said >> I don't know for word for that. You told you told me a month and a half. >> I [snorts] thought it was like a month and I don't know. >> And you tell investigators my nose. You tell the investigators in the California Police Department back then that it was two to three days prior to the fire. >> So two to three days, month and a half, eight months in this community. >> You're talking 20ome years ago. >> You drew the picture to perfection. >> Oh, the house the house wasn't a big deal cuz come on. You talked about a life insurance policy that you said was several four, five, six months prior to taking it out on a doubt. We know for factual that I said >> it was a matter of weeks beforehand, a short term before the fire starts and takes your wife's life. >> I thought it was like four months. >> You tell me that the kerosene was brought in to the house that day >> to fuel a kerosene furnace. Yet you tell investigators back then in 1991 that it was mistakenly you thought it was water. You brought in the house as a five gallon jug of water >> to fuel to put in a toilet to flush the toilet because your pipes were frozen >> and mistakenly kerosene was brought in and knocked on the floor. >> But yet you tell me kerosene and then you tell me that a dog knocks over a 5 gallon bucket. >> Not easy almost impossible to knock over a 5 gallon bucket and spill it. And you tell investigators back then it was a matter of days before it was spilled. You tell me it was five or six, seven weeks it was spilled before the >> I didn't say five, six, seven weeks. >> Oh, you did. You did tell me that. >> I said it was it was weeks be before but I said we you know it wasn't five, six, seven weeks. I don't think >> kerosene is almost impossible to catch fire. >> You you had almost a fire going to start kos. >> You tell you tell the investigators earlier clearly that it's a gas fired dryer in your house nearby. You tell me that is >> it was an electric dryer. You tell invest back then it was electric and they questioned you about whether it was gas and you clearly said no it was an electric dryer. >> Well then I'm wrong there cuz I I >> and now we talk about >> 20 some years later >> and you you were 600 ft away from the house yet your wife's in a boarded up little room and you hear her calling your name from 600. calling. They was screaming, >> screaming your name. And yet you're able to get blown off the porch, open your eyes, your son's uninjured. You're able to grab your uninjured son out where this explosion just took place without a mark on him, take him out of the house, run around, miraculously save your two daughters and let your wife and which let your wife perish in this fire with no attempt to rip that board off that fivee board off that house and get into that bathroom and help. I went by that time the fire was all the way around. What am I going to do? >> No, that fire was all the way around and you don't take a chance to look in that window and see your wife. There's no flames in that bathroom >> until until you're there. >> Your sister-in-law tells me that when they fly out there, they fly out to California to be there with you that you want to go show them redwood trees and go dance and go dance on a redwood tree and go around. It lets nothing happen. No, I >> as investigators start talking to you, you decide after three or four days of being after the fire, you're done with California and you move back up to New York. >> I didn't get tickets and didn't say anything about tickets. They got the tickets >> and now >> talk to my brother. He's the one who got them. I guess I paid for I paid later for him to reimburse him, but they come out with the tickets. >> Police have done a fantastic job laying out everything that was wrong with what Carl did the day of the fire. That evidence alone is enough for anyone to suspect Carl. But there was even more implicating him. For starters, at the time of Chris's death, she was planning on leaving him. After 3 years of physical and emotional violence, she confided in her sister that she was going to take their three kids and leave after the holiday season. She wanted to start life over away from Carl, but she never got the chance. >> I wish your first wife wish she had a different h a different husband. You know, >> she'd be alive now and Levi be alive now. It's a pretty sad picture when you see the two of them. Your little baby son, Levi, with your wife, your first wife. >> I don't think you have the right to to say that. >> Oh, I think I do. >> Okay. >> I think I absolutely do. >> I would do anything for Levi. I do anything for Chris. Anything >> as long as as long as life insurance policies. >> I don't give a [ __ ] about the money. I made money. >> You did? Where was it? Where was it when Levi died in 2008? Where was your money? >> Ask the wife. >> You had none. >> Uh, ask the wife. >> You your your entire retirement plan, you worked you were 45, 47, 48 years old and you had a who $30,000 with no income from anymore and you live the rest of your life on it. >> Just 3 days after his wife died, Carl cashed in on the life insurance policy he had urged her to get months before, a policy totaling $200,000. He then used that money to buy himself a house in New York where he quickly met his next wife, [music] Cindy, and proceeded to act as though Christina hadn't existed at all. All along, however, his own kids had their suspicions about their mother's death. Primarily because the day before the fires, Carl had taken the Christmas tree and lit it on fire with kerosene for the kids to see. He told them he wanted it to be a demonstration and learning lesson for them, one that taught them, and I quote, how quickly a house can burn down. But all those details are for the California police to narrow down for a conviction. Now, Cynica Sheriff's Office is hoping they can get answers about Levi's death. >> I mean, you look at everything laid out from the California prior to now. >> I mean, it's pretty damning evidence. >> Oh, I know. I've always I've poisoned them. >> What I think you need to do is look at the little damage control and you come straight on. >> No, no, no, no. I'm not even going to that just >> cuz I'll tell you right now that story just doesn't hold up. It doesn't make sense. >> And and I don't think you're helping yourself by sticking to it. If you're out there, I mean, you know, it's not It is the truth. >> It is. >> There's no way that you walk away from your son and leave him there thinking he's pretty much >> deceased and then go away for 4 and 1 half hours and then come back >> and then put on a big show with everybody. like I told him when >> I'm not ridiculous >> when when it's like I told this when I told him out >> and I seen his face it was like it was real. It was like it was >> so a guy like you that's mechanically minded that knows how to jack up a car, you jack [clears throat] it up wrong. >> I didn't jack it up wrong. I mean I jack he knows the kind of jack I'm talking about. I know the kind of jack. And I know from being on a farm my whole life, none of us would ever jack it up and leave. Let our son ever get under a jack with a single railroad jack under it. The most tippiest things in the world. >> Well, it had blocks under the drums cuz the tires were off. >> The tires were off and the thing was up on a single jack, a pivot point. Just as you des just as you described, Cindy, you described it right to the teeth on how you set it up. Inject it more. Inject it more. Inject it more. Let's go over some of the Let's go over some of the statements you made. [snorts] You say this isn't a trap. He said he says a trap. Like what kind of trap? How can I trap you to get my I couldn't hear the rest of that. No. Why would I do that, Carl? You've already told me. Can you understand where I'm coming from? Is what you told her. And [clears throat] then you go on and say, "This is this is not setting up a trap." No. I mean, how am I going to set a trap? Do you want to go through my purse? And you say, "But you can understand where I'm coming from." Cindy says, "Yes, I understand. I told you. I understand that." And Carl says, "I mean, it's been just give me a few minutes here." Okay. [snorts] Cindy says, "Do you understand?" Carl, you can't understand being in my shoes since I can't even imagine like what I what I told you. You go on with this conversation and you say to her, just hear me out. It was never meant to be. You know what I'm saying? It was never planned from the day one for this to ever go this way. And Cindy says, "What do you mean day one?" Like, you know what the time the insurance stuff I don't >> I don't ever think that. Don't ever think that it was insurance, Carl. It's just when I went in there, he couldn't get under. I raised it up and it was wobbly and it was sort of like all of a sudden everything just it was like you said the other day on the second page. So he says, "Carl, you keep talking about the second page. I can't remember." And you respond, "It was one the one where you said how you felt about the one that you said how you felt about things after the fact." And Cindy replies, "All right, I said a couple different things." And you went on to say, 'Well, everything you said, you know about the past with him and all that everything else. And so he says, "Right, but how about now?" You said, "Right." How it how he it wasn't like it was almost sort of a relief. >> Now Carl's wife Cindy had to wear a wire twice to get his confession. In the first confession, he fully admitted to the murder. But as you're about to hear, he did it so quietly that the mic wasn't able to pick it up. >> If you said yes or no to what I asked you, then I would know that you you want to move forward, but I can't get back with you without you telling her. A few days later, Cindy tried again, but this time Carl was suspicious. >> I mean, you're sorry about that, right? >> Okay, Carl. And I believe that. Can you just tell me what happened that day? >> That's not what you told me. That's not what you told me. What did I say? >> I asked you if you pushed the gas. I said I had nothing to do, but I said I took advantage of the situation. >> This is a trap. >> Can you understand where I'm coming from? >> In that first confession, Carl had admitted that he purposefully knocked the jack over, killing his son. In the second, he was much less willing to tell the truth. And in this interrogation, he's willing to tell police anything but the truth. >> You jacked it up so it was like a wheelbarrow backwards >> and it just shook. Easy to push over. And CSU doesn't push hard. And you said no, it was easy. It pushed easy, >> right? >> Do you remember saying that that push easy? >> Yeah, I guess >> it doesn't it doesn't push easy. And she asked you, did you feel any pain? Remember that? >> No, I don't. >> And you said no, you don't think so. you think was instantaneous when it crushed them. She's talking about when you pushed it and she asked you if it pushed easy. >> We could go on and on. This is this is this is this is the first seven minutes of this audio confession. You want Cindy back so bad that you ultimately tell her what you did. >> No, I wanted her back. >> No, I mean I knew at first it was I thought right off the bat that's why I talked to the neighbors. It's a trap. It's a trap. I caught my daughter. Now, hear me out, P. And I thought, it's a trap. It's a freaking trap. And I says, "What is her motive?" And I asked my daughter. I asked my friend. I says, "This is not right." And and that's why I talked to the neighbor. I says, you know, and I said, >> "What was the You told the neighbor what?" >> No, I didn't say what it was. >> You said the sign was trapping you. >> I just said, "What is her motive?" I said, "Here she's telling me." I says, "What woman could forgive?" You know, and you know what I'm saying? What? No, I don't know what you're saying. >> What woman could ever And I says, I think she's thinking I had something to do with Levi's death. >> You told your neighbors this. >> Yes. >> What neighbors? >> This. >> You told Amy that Sydney thought you had something to do with Levi's death and and that Cindy was trying to trap you. >> And I says, "What? What else could be your motive? What's what's And >> what do you mean? What could be her motive? What is her motive? >> I don't know. >> No, you said you told me that what could be her motive?" >> Yeah, that's what I said. >> Her motive for what? >> I don't know. I don't know if it was to do with the divorce. I don't know. What is her motive for what though? For meeting with you, to try to get back to you, to be romantically involved. >> I don't know. And this is because she I don't know. That's >> You're telling me that you didn't want a relationship with Sydney? >> I did. >> Okay. So, what's what is you saying? What is her motive for coming back? >> Well, at first it's like what is her what is the motive for all this? You know, I mean, I'm looking at it like why would she bring it up? And I'm like talking to the neighbor and trying to figure it out. Okay. You're talking I'm kind of lost here. You're talking to the neighbor. You said your neighbor. >> It's sort of blowing my mind. You know >> what did you tell the neighbor? >> That pretty much what Cindy said, you know, about >> about this about all the pushing the car over and I didn't talk to her about that. >> Did you tell Cindy that you when she asked you if the car if you pushed the car over and leave and she asked you did it push harder? Do you remember telling her no it pushed easy? >> I I don't remember. >> Could have said that. >> I could if it's on the audio. If it it is then I I said it. Yeah. But I'm just saying. >> So when you tell Cindy that the truck pushed easy. Why would you say it pushed easy? That the truck pushed easy over. I don't know. >> I don't know. >> I guess >> I guess the the thing is for me is like like I say, I talked to the neighbor about why would she be doing this? I said because I told the neighbor ahead of time. I said, you know, I'm trying to what would you think if I tried to get back with her and all this stuff? And they're like, you know, geez. And then I said this and she's like, "Holy shit." And that's when I told her, I says, "I'm going to play. I want to see what she does." >> So you you only said that you said that you push it. >> I'm feeding Cindy information. And like I'm playing it up and because it's >> Oh, you're This is all a play. >> Yeah. Because it's like >> So you didn't really push it around. You just said you pushed around because >> she said until I She was waiting for that one word. What word? >> That I must have killed him or something. That's all I could think of because I kept like I told the neighbor. I said she's looking for something. >> Well, you continued to converse with her. >> You were scared to death about telling her the truth that you were scared to death about being set up. This was a police setup. >> Well, I said Oh, yeah. I said that >> you thought this was a police setup and she was working for the police, did you not? >> I Oh, yeah. I fig I figured. >> Did you know that? Did you know? Did you think because you were in a public place that she couldn't set you up because of the noise in there and so forth? she picked the place to meet. >> Carl was so desperate to get back with Cindy and so certain that he would that he even told multiple friends that the two were reuniting and were going to fix their marriage. In reality, however, Cindy was scared for her life. Initially, she left Carl due to her suspicions about his involvement in the murder of Levi and Christina. Soon, those suspicions morphed into fear that she was the next one on the chopping block. After all, Carl had urged her to take out a life insurance policy for the safety of their kids and grandkids. >> So, these were just a lot of coincidences that you take a life insurance policy on your wife a matter of 3 weeks, two weeks, one week before the fire. Just a lot of coincidence that she goes in the bathtub and a fire starts out right outside in the middle of the floor of that door, a hallway. It's where fires always start. All >> she has every time we've done fires, Jack, always start in the hallway with no with no source of the fire out. But that's but that's a coincidence. Just total coincidence. You go on, you collect $200,000, $210, $215,000. You come back here, you buy your farm. >> No, I didn't buy a farm. >> Ultimately, you did. Did you not ultimately buy a farm? You bought a house. Then you ultimately bought your parents' car, >> right? And I I paid my dad for it. >> You sure did. But ultimately I worked for Levi. This one son over here is this black sheep son. The one son that you don't get along with. >> No, you can't say that. Oh, you have great friends with him >> at the end. Very much so. >> So, Levi, just total coincidence, takes out a $700,000 license policy and respond to that. He doesn't get along with his sole beneficiary. And you happen to pay the policy and his death takes place one day before he has to have his physical, which you know, both know he's not because of the situation he has with his throat. >> You're you're very familiar with his medical history. So he comes over to your house. You entice him over your house. >> I don'tice him over the house to pay him money. >> You're not going to pay him money? >> Yeah, but I'm not enticing him. It's just what he always done. >> Levi, come on over. I got $50 for you. Can you come? You're broke and I got money for you. >> No, he wasn't broke. He was working at Guardian at the time. >> So he he was flushed with money. >> No, he had I mean when you >> So now he comes over to your house with a $700,000 life insurance policy one day from his physical. You go >> I don't know when his physical was. I don't know what it was. >> You go out there, he gets under this truck that your son, the one you're supposed to love and care for. This is your blood, your flesh and blood, and you jack it up on the on the chintziest, lousiest jacking system going that we both know being with no blocks, no nothing to support in case it falls over. Just it's only my son going underneath there. And if this truck falls on, it'll crush and kill him. But miraculously, the truck falls over on him while you're there. And you say, >> I wasn't in there when it happened. You say, you might say that, but we both know you were in there. >> And you then just say, "Well, the trucks crush them. Oh, I don't want to take advantage of it, but I sure I'm happy that maybe I leaned up against it and fell over on him." And then I go back in the house. I don't mention anybody. I don't call for help. Did you call 911 for help? >> I did. >> Did you call for help? So, he needed help and you're his biological father and you don't give him help. What kind of father are you? >> Piece of [ __ ] >> Exactly. You don't give him help. You let him be crushed under there. You go back AND GO, "OKAY, HONEY. LET'S GO TO YOUR uncle's funeral down. And you get in that car and you drive and you know you're unemotional driving along four and a half hours into it. You drive down. You drive back and you say, "Show time. I need to put on a show to make it so nobody knows what happened." And you go out that garage where the radio's been cranked up. So when he when you the truck crushed him, he could scream and yell and nobody could hear his screams. Country music, which he didn't listen to, you know, he didn't like. And it's screaming. It's blaring. It's blaring loud so he can't be heard. And you come back and you say again, it's showtime for Carl to put on my show. My miraculously I'm a liar show. And you go run back house go, "OH MY GOD, SYDNEY, HURRY. Call 911. The truck fell over on Carl." Well, you've known there for 4 and a half hours and you want them to come out to your son's cold body and then you jack it up. Go up in there. Jack up. So, let's cover this. Jack up. We'll pull them out. We'll talk about the the wrench that's clutching his hand and oh my goodness, he's dead. And I just found out about it. I saw it as soon as we got back. Now it's showtime. Put on the tears. Put on the crying. There was no crying for four and a half hours when he was dead. Now it's showtime for the tears. No problem. Everybody buys it. The police buy it. Cindy buys it. I get my within one month. I'm there. I'm adamant. I get my $700,000 policy. I don't take my $700,000 spent on the grandkids which my son intended for. I say, "Hey, I'm broke. My my insurance, my policy, my retirement plan went from over $100,000 down to $30,000. I am flushing money again." >> No, this was in the wife's name, too. >> It It was Le's death was in the wife's name. Bull. It was in your name. >> It was in my name, but when we invested it in >> because she found out about it and you were pretty much screwed. She found out about the $700,000 life insurance policy and you would look like a really a greedy SOP if you took it all. So you share you share the wealth. Honey, we'll put $400 or $500,000. >> We'll get we'll give the grandkids a little something. >> No, it was her decision to see to she decided how much went in the girls. You ask her that. That was she decided. >> Oh, so so so what? You're both greedy. You both need the four 500,000 and the grandkids don't need anything. The grandkids mother anything. These girls got to be raised from the time they're two and four years old and they get nothing. >> But Carl says, "I can take care of myself. Le Oh, I couldn't take care of it. Levi did not want Cassie to know about it or to get a penny from it. Levi did. >> And he didn't want the He [clears throat] wanted the grand kids to grow up in squalor, didn't he? He wanted them to grow up in a [ __ ] house in a [ __ ] crap trailer living like Paul when their dad had $715,000 in life insurance. So Carl got to build up his little independence. >> Well, no, you need >> No, because you you you squandered away like you had your whole life doesn't mean that you you didn't take it for yourself. You took the money for yourself and put little to nothing in the girl's name. And ultimately that money was in the girl's name. You had total disregard for that, too, because you had no problem taking that money out of it and put it right back in your pocket. >> No, I had a problem with >> Oh, really? Where is it? You had such a problem. Is it in the girl name? >> The wife. >> Oh, she took it out and you didn't take anything. You didn't benefit from it. Oh, we both did. We both did. >> Levi had two beautiful daughters at the time of his death. Two daughters who were living with his ex-wife in a run-down trailer and whose lives could have been changed by the $700,000 that was meant for them. But they hardly got a scent. Carl and Cindy used the $700,000 to fund business ventures, frequent trips to California, and nice cars. Meanwhile, Levi's children, their grandchildren, suffered. didn't kill him. Okay, let's get that straight. I did not kill him. >> What kill him? >> The truck. >> How' the truck kill him? >> It landed on him. And I had nothing to do with the truck landing on it. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. >> Just fell over. >> What do you want me to say? I don't know if he was reefing underneath on something. >> Insurance policy just happened three weeks beforehand. Just happened to have a day beforehand. >> It's his business. this statement. >> You know what we all we all admit to pushing trucks over ourselves. I mean it's an everyday why why would we ever I mean you would never we make our lives like that all the time just to bolster how what a great image. >> I tell people all the time I kill somebody or child just because it makes me a better person. >> No >> makes and my updated women are so attractive. I'm sure Cindy would say boy what a wonderful husband to do that to our son. I really want him back. So that you tell her that for what reason? >> Are you that naive? >> No, I just like I didn't know. >> You just wanted to play the game. Play along. >> Do you think that anybody's going to believe >> No. >> That you confessed to Cindy because you were playing a game with her and you left your son laying there dead because you were in shock for 4 and a half hours. Do you think people are going to believe that? >> I No. >> No, they're not. So you don't you think the image control here and start telling what really happened. >> That's what happened. >> That's not what happened. >> It did. >> It did. It did not happen that way. There's no way. >> I've been around a long time, Carl. Nobody does that. >> Do you mind if I stand back up again? >> Jesus Christ, Carl. Well, I can't tell you something that's not true, sir. >> Yeah, I can because you did tell me some stuff that wasn't true and you admitted it wasn't true. So, don't tell that. Don't give me that lie. >> Not >> I'm trying to help you and you're just you're just wanting it in my face and it's kind of irritating me to be honest with you. >> Um, >> you know, I'll go out on a limb for you to try and show that maybe there's some extenduating circumstances here and then and and you're going to throw this whole story. Come on. No one's going to believe that, Carl. I can be hardressed to find anybody that would give that any credence at all. Doesn't matter to me, Carl. I get paid by the hour. But if you want to help yourself, you ought to explain why you push that truck. It was a split-second decision. Had nothing to do with insurance money. Okay, we can deal with that. But if not, it's going to be worst case scenario, my man. >> Don't look good before you. I got to get my medicine. >> What kind of medicine is it? >> I've got um I don't even know the name of the one. The other one is my um pain pills and I need my patches. >> Where are they? >> They're at home. >> Well, Carl, you're not going home. >> All right, Carl. I really wish he'd last chance, buddy. After this, then things go as they go. You want to give me a chance to help you or not? >> I can't tell you what didn't happen, sir. And I mean it. >> I don't want you to. [sighs] >> But what you told me so far doesn't make any sense at all. And you know it doesn't. I can't do any more than that. And I and I I do apologize, but it's it's it's just like I blanked out when I saw him. >> It's like I zoned out when I saw him. You know, when it happened when I walked out there and seen him, it was like >> Was it possible that guilt made you black out? They will. >> No, because I didn't push the truck. I mean, it just >> Are you sure? I I am 1,000,000%. >> Kyle, just in the in the seven hours we've spent here, you've told a lot of lies. Told some truths, but the problem when you tell lies, it's hard to keep track of them. 99% of what you were asked today, we already knew the answer to. >> Well, a lot of it was just seeing if you're going to be honest or not. And I'm kind of disappointed. cuz you're not being >> some things I can't remember. It's happened so the drugs that you don't know. You guys don't understand. And I'm not blaming the drugs, don't get me wrong, but I'm just saying that. >> All right. Well, let me see about if what we can do about that. Carl has just realized how screwed he really is and police aren't even playing all of his cards because not only is Carl suspected of killing Levi and Christina, but two other fraud crimes as well. In 1986, his brand new Mustang spontaneously combusted in his driveway. He was reimbured and paid out more than what the vehicle was worth from his insurance company. Then in 2002, his barn in New York caught on fire. a barn which conveniently housed his prized mare and two of her fos. Now, if you know horse racing, you know there's money there. Carl got over $100,000 from his insurance company over his barn burning down and the loss of his horses. That's a lot of bad luck with fires for one person, isn't it? >> But look what happens to me. I'm going to go to jail. >> I don't know what's going to happen to you yet >> for something I didn't do. you know, for some I didn't do. I let him down. I walked away and I lived with that for four years. You know, you guys somehow, you know, pulled that out of me and in a way it's been a relief. >> Good. It should be relief. I never hurt him. >> You did. It's all right. Come on. You're that close, man. You're close. Come on. Let it out. Let it out. Let it out. I'll walk with you, man. I'll walk with you. You're this close, man. You're the closest you're going to be. Come on. [clears throat] I'll walk with you if you do. I'll stand up for you. >> What are you going to do for me? >> I'm going to stand up and say this wasn't premeditated cold blooded murder. that it was just something that happened. [ __ ] happens sometimes, Carl. That's what I'll do for you. [snorts] >> I open the truck door. >> Okay. >> When they did it >> [laughter] [snorts and laughter] >> And if I hit box underneath it, it wouldn't happen. [clears throat] Probably an accident. Why you trying to hide it? >> I'm scared. You're very You're very close. >> I didn't do it. [laughter] >> I think part [snorts] of you did maybe not all of it. >> No way. I didn't. There was nothing. You can do it. >> [snorts] >> this egg and then I open up the door and stepped in my back door. to open the truck door cuz I had to get inside to move the linkage for truck and when I did it tipped and it just over [snorts] there my friend got >> [snorts] [snorts] >> I had nothing to do with any of the other things. I don't give a [ __ ] how bad it looks. this area. I got in the truck and opened the door cuz we couldn't get or the wipe out [snorts] and it was because I stepped in the truck and it just it just fell that you did it because he was a He was never a burn. Not when he got into Guardian and stuff. He was great. >> I mean, I played along with her and I did. I did. >> I know. It's sick. It's sick. And it's just exactly what I told. It's exactly what I said. This is sick. [snorts] >> Now, you see Carl was laughing. We've gone from he was dead when you walked in there to now that it fell when you opened the door. >> I know. So take the final step. >> There is no more. And I swear on anything I will do anything I will jump off. [sighs and gasps] I stepped in the truck and fell and I was just scared shitless. I don't know why. How you could come you know you could call 911. I mean I'm not I don't know. I mean, there's always a chance. You don't just walk away. >> You just I think it still happened for a reason. Even if you didn't really maybe 100% consciously realize it. Maybe he was better off at it. I don't know. >> No, I know. >> So, the truck fell on on your son and instead of jacking it back up, you ran. >> You You grew up on a farm. You How many times you run those jacks? >> Thousand times. >> A thousand times. you know that it it would take you about less than a minute to jack that truck back up. And that's on a >> Oh, I know. >> And on a super strength, maybe you could lift it and push a maneuver and and he could breathe again as collapse because people suffocate. Like if they're digging a ditch and the ditch collapses in >> the dirt doesn't kill him. Their lungs can't expand and he can't breathe. So your son was still very much alive >> and you could have saved him and you could have brought a life but you ran and let him die. What? Why? Because of the insurance policy? >> No. No. No. It just I'm scared. I don't know. I don't >> It had nothing to do with insurance. >> Nothing. I never even thought of it at that time. I just thought, "Oh, >> do you think that I believe that?" >> I don't care what anybody believes. I really don't anymore. >> Do you think anybody in this world is going to believe? >> Probably not. Probably not. And you know, >> cuz this is the third story you've told us. Not the first, not the second. >> To shoot away my It's the It's the third story. Tell the one thing you have to do is you have to at some point tell the truth. [clears throat] The honest truth, not another story, another version. Do I think it got pushed over? Yes. Do I think it was maybe when you got in the truck to push it over? Yes. Do I think it was because you were in your heart to kill him for no reason? Yes. >> No. That's [ __ ] >> But what's the reason? >> I got in the truck to kill him. >> No, I didn't kill him. >> You did kill him. You did kill him. I did >> intentionally. >> No, >> accidentally. >> Yeah, it was an accident. >> Just when it fell over on him instead of going to his aid as rescue of your son, you said nah, >> it wasn't. >> He's dead. He's going to die if I don't help him. So, I'm not going to help him. What did you say? I don't want him to live. >> Nothing. It just I just >> Nothing. >> Didn't you Didn't you You're in the military. Didn't you tell me investigator earlier that you maybe you killed people saved lives? You go blank. You I went blank. It's my kid. It's just >> No, nobody goes blank in that regard. They go blank in the other regard. People have such human incredible strength in a moment of disaster, a catastrophe like that. If people have been known to pick cars up single hand >> and I said, >> and you run, not only do you run, you don't run and go in a panic. You get in your car calmly and say to your wife, "Hey, hun, are you ready to go to the funeral? I think somebody's underneath the car that I just knocked over on him accidentally. So, let's go. And if I'll bet you in four and a half hours when we get back, he [snorts] won't be alive. Is that what you said? And then we'll get the $700,000 insurance policy. >> What did you say? You said, "Okay, Sydney, let's go. I can put on another act like I've been doing to you guys for the last few hours." >> No, I probably didn't say >> And I can put this act on. >> I probably didn't say five words all the way over the whole day. >> See this guy here? He believes you. Me? I I I'm not that I'm not the guy that's reading your story here. >> No, I don't know what to tell you anymore. >> I think for once once in your life, I don't know if [snorts] you've done it in 50 years, but I think it's about time you sit on you told somebody the truth. >> I did not kill him. >> You killed him? >> No, I didn't. >> Oh, you killed him. Intentionally killed him. >> No, I did not. >> Carl, you killed him and you pushed that truck over him and knowing that you could have saved him. knowing that you could have helped him. You never wanted to help him. You never wanted to save him and get that truck off him. >> No, >> because $700,000 plus was waiting for you. >> Who gives a [ __ ] about the money? >> Well, you very much gave a [ __ ] >> What does >> In fact, you tell me how excited you were about this big Mar horse you had that was going to make you millions of dollars. Make you millions of dollars. >> But that was that was >> You're a money driven individual, Carl. Period. >> Yeah. >> $700,000 is what you had gained from his debt. 200,000 is what you had gained from your wife's death in California. >> Oh, it was that was a lot of my feedback. >> Does that Does that replace a wife? Does that replace the kids's mother? >> To you was a benefit. >> It didn't do nothing. >> Levi's two girls grew up without truly knowing their father. Levi's ex-wife, who he still loved dearly, was left to raise them with no financial support. Meanwhile, the man you're looking at was squandering the money meant for them on business ventures that never paid off. What business ventures, you might ask? Ducks. Yes, ducks with a D. Levi planned to raise a heritage duck breed to sell to local restaurants at a premium price. Soon after Levi's death, he went from having a handful of ducks to having thousands. And if you've ever had ducks, you know you ain't making quack off of them, which ultimately Carl did not. You know, [clears throat] I'm going to go out to get a statement for him so the bank cler can finish taking a statement from me. Let me get his paper. I'm not going to call you a liar. I'm going to tell you that you're as untruthful as any person I've ever met and attempt to be more manipulative and to do what you did to your son and try to tell us three different versions of it without still telling the truth shows me who you really are. Ultimately, Carl was arrested that very day for seconddegree murder and additional charges related to insurance fraud. He took a plea deal at his 2013 trial, resulting in a sentence of 15 years to life for killing his son, Levi. In 2020, he was extradited to California, where he was sentenced to life for the first-degree murder of his first wife, Christina. He will spend the rest of his life behind bars. Our thoughts are with Levi's family, his children, and his friends. His sisters lost not just their mother, but their brother and father. We also send our condolences to Christina's sister, parents, and friends, all of whom lost a bright light that was taken far, far too soon. Thank you for watching today's video. Whether you're new here or have been with us for a while, check out one of the craziest cases I've ever covered right here, or one of my newest uploads right here.