mandoa where did I get shot and she's like you got shot in the neck I'm like okay and I started like freaking out a little bit right and so like yeah mandoa was like I need you to look at me we're going to combat brief together but I thought this is how I die for sure right and not knowing that none of my rounds are fatal I didn't know all the time and I felt like if I looked away from Amanda there'd be the reaper sitting right next to me and that would be it this is 56 a penel County Sheriff's Office podcast I'm Rickie Butler with Laura Sullivan and Ashley [ __ ] March 12th 2023 is a day we are not going to forget anytime soon because that is the day that on a routine K9 track Corporal Aken and his partner Taco uh were ambushed by suspect they were searching for and Matt was shot three times went down and unfortunately for the suspect uh well Taco was there number one and number two uh former SWAT guy former canine Handler former major league baseball player Sergeant Jake Viano was just happened to be uh not even nearby but came down to run back up for Matt uh they worked together for a long time and just happened to be there and uh was able to dispatch the suspect was able to thanks to Taco and being a great partner and they made a formidable team put some rounds uh On Target and the suspect is no longer with us but Corporal Ain is and we are happy to have Matt on the podcast with us today uh we are going to we want to know all about you we've talked a lot about uh the shooting this shooting has gotten some incredible coverage and the terrorism and the awards and all that but there's a actual almost 20-year deputy sheriff under all that somewhere that has been has a great backstory and we're going to get into that today uh on this episode so before we do that though Ashley has a question you've been doing good about make us all uncomfortable yeah remembering I know yeah all right question today if you could be an expert on one thing think like the matrix it's just downloaded instantly you know everything inside and out about this subject this skill something like that what would you choose I had some time to think about this for myself so you maybe one a minute wow yeah you have you know everything about it there's no and you can obviously use it you know for a career or whatever like you are however however you want to utilize it that's what I'm thinking CU my first thought was like all about you know animal behavior or something which I'm personally interested in but then I'm thinking well should I know all about Finance should I know all about language something I can corrupt to my own benefit well I mean I went there too at first I don't know your bumper sticker says you support snake education I do I could learn all about uh how to educate snakes right UC snakes yeah make sure they're educated yeah we need smarter snakes yeah I'm not going with that for the record um everybody else go I uh yeah I mean I guess like the stock market yeah if you're going to put it all together because you're sought after and then you have all kinds of resources and you can do all kinds of crazy things whatever you want yeah that's a good one it is so I could go two ways with this one I could go the rooky way I want to everything about gambling what are the odds in roulette what are the odds in TAS what are the odds in blackjack yeah when to hit when to fold right all that stuff yeah the other way I could go is anything that is something that is so still complex is everything around uh the brain neurological stuff right like why why is this happening or if you knew exactly the pain that you had in your XYZ you knew exactly how to fix it immediately right that's there it is you get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to go stand in front of at a podium in front of a bunch of white coats and C that's this thing yeah I just thought to a whole audience of people likees tell me how you feel this is why you feel like that you can't be safe next oh you wouldn't sugar coat that at all I like I like that don't go down the road of medicine you're you're screwed the rest of your life and then he's got a talk show where he just brings people on and diagnoses them either way there's money to be made yeah yeah true and benefit to people Laur are you there yet yeah we're all pretty materialistic aren't we yeah um yeah I'm G it's got to be something money-making I don't know you can't say I don't know L what do you got you got time to think about it Ashley I did um at first I thought maybe it would be one of my hobbies um but then I feel like that takes the fun out of that hobby when you know everything about it inside and out part of what makes it fun is the learning is the trial and error good point um one thing that I wish I knew everything about and it's selfish but I wish I knew everything about cooking like how to put things together that will I'm a picky eater and I would like to be able to eat much healthier and know how to make like the best combinations of things without even thinking about it just boom it's just natural for me and I just got it figured out and I can focus on the rest of my life interesting and you can make money with that too you could we are all material like that we're focused on money that's a good point yeah I wasn't focus on money I'm focus on me though but but but but I'm just saying cuz I said oh you can make money everything there is to know about anything you can make money probably this is true yeah have your your own cooking show unless you want to know everything about not making money oh yes that's deep rookie I'm going to I'm going to go back to uh yeah I'm going to go back to animal behavior yeah yeah so like like like where where eels go to reproduce that kind of thing what would you do the mysteries of life like teaching or no that's a thing yeah okay got it that was good that was a good one yeah all right Matt um where'd you grow up where'd you come from uh grew up in Jersey I was born and raised in New Jersey I'm so sorry I haven't been there I've just I've just did you know the situation no okay that's yeah you so you have to address Jersey Jersey is split in two North Jersey and South Jersey they're two different states and where is the split like probably Trenton is that in the middle Jersey City Trenton okay yeah uh both areas are uh gross right but so North Jersey that's your Garden State right jersey is known as the Garden State that's North Jersey South Jersey uh Dirty South Jersey uh it's a great place to be from uh to be from Jersey Jersey makes you hard you know it's uh it's uh a good spot to grow up um I was born in uh Collingswood um and so Jersey has all these small little cities and townships uh and every single Township and city has their own uh police department so I was born in Collingswood but then I did most of my um adolescent years in Haden Heights so Haden Heights had their own uh police department I think they had like seven officers and so but every other uh municipality or Township had their own Police Department of like seven or eight cops you know so it's it's uh not like this um like country Southern small town but very similar to that because everyone went to the same Market in Haden Heights everyone knew each other um you there was one high school to go to outside of a private school me my brother and sister all went to a private school in Haden Heights um and then in uh around right around Junior High I moved to Cherry Hill okay so you have a brother and sister are you the where do you fall are you the oldest youngest midle I'm the youngest okay I'm the youngest um they both still live up north okay um my brother is he was a um firefighter paramedic for 13 or 14 years um a lot of time spent in Trenton so um like in the worst trauma issues he could probably face MH and then uh I moved down here in 2005 okay went to the academy at the end of ' 05 got higher than 06 and then just over time I had better stories than my brother so he uh he left fire and uh paramedic and he got hired by Temple University uh campus police oh okay but Temple is in I believe West Philly which is a really bad part of Philly uh I used to work at the University of Pennsylvania at the hospital cuz my dad was an administrator there and so I worked there um prior to moving down here just doing like patient transport uh it was decent money and hanging out in the hospital and everyone knew me because everyone knew my dad um so let's back up a little bit so you get in trouble when you were a kid no not at all um really cuz I watched my brother and sister get in trouble knew what not to do um or how not get caught not get caught is a better way for yeah no I was I mean I was pretty good I was a pretty good kid um I'm probably around uh high school going into college when I kind of like started want to do my own thing but um school was tough for me uh I really had to work at school to get get good grades um and it's funny because uh I tell people this all the time especially uh um like some of the young younger guys that I know that wanted to go to the academy or trying to think of what they want to do um like the Killian boys you know I'm really close to the Killian family you know all through high school and even my first couple semesters in college I just didn't go you know my my Dad paid for all these credits and I would just rather party than go to college you know go to class whatever and then when I made the decision that you know I'm I'm going to move down to Florida and I'm going to go to the police academy and I'm going to I'm going to make something out of this I got 4.0 all through college it was easy and once you're motivated once you're motivated and the college was it was just stupid easy it's like how did I not do well this even high school thinking of other things in high school a genius let's not get crazy so as a kid though but was he a tactical genius probably not um so what were we into when you were a kid heard you like to play the drums I did how' you get into that I played the drums when I was uh about nine or 10 years old I started was there what what I mean how do you so I think I think what started me off on doing that is we had a family friend uh his name was Bill Scully he just passed away a few years ago um I grew up with a guy but he played drums in our church MH and he was just a phenomenal drummer and he uh he paved the way to kind of um I started playing in church a little bit with him and then um he worked with my dad to find a good drum set for me and then I was just hooked and I just I did that every day until I was about 21 22 drumming every day so you're probably pretty good every day yeah I'd like to think so we got to get a drum set in here feel like that's like a parents horse night all the instruments you can get for your kid yeah so when we were in cherot Hill uh I me I would play hours I would play my hands were bleeding I mean it was what did you what did you play I mean I played everything favorite songs whatever just crank it out just crank it out I play everything so I never I never wanted to be stuck in one genre I could play anything uh of hip-hop to Dave Matthews to metal stuff I could play anything I really wanted to be when I first was going through High School my my goal was to be a studio drummer you know whatever artists come in I want to play drums for that artist whether it be you know ballads or heavy metal whatever it is I want to play everything so I was I and I still have a very eclectic uh music you know taste but um but when I was in Cherry Hill you know my drums were in the garage and I had a massive drum set I had like 17 symbols it was insane yeah like Neil perk from mar Just massive right just missing the gong you know but uh so cherro Hill is uh it's it's it's a traditionally a Jewish neighborhood there's a lot of money and there's a lot of older people in Cherry Hill it's where a lot of the money comes from right and across the street from me and down maybe three or four houses there was an older couple and they hated me they called the police all the time and we like we made efforts to soundproof my garage a little bit and the police would come to and they would hear it and they like that's what they complained about you can barely hear it you know but uh but my parents were awesome about it you know it was never time like he can we be done like they really support Ed it um awesome yeah it was really cool and I got into playing um a couple bands and the last band I was in we did really well um we played a bunch of shows in Philly um had a little bit of a following some of the bigger um places that we played at um some of the bands that played through there was train and uh Switchfoot a place called the Northstar and uh GP Street Pub those were big ones and in Philly that that we got the opportunity to play in um and then it started it started falling apart and at some point I'm like all right well what why did it fall apart uh a girl yeah I was going to guess I was going to guess Yoko got in between right always always it so funny cuz like it was me and one other guy that really started it and then we started piecing it together with with other other people that played and everyone in the band was very like uh like-minded like me is we we didn't want to fall into one draer we can play anything and the guy who started the band he was uh I don't know if he's still playing um but as far as a songwriter he's extremely talented ented extremely talented you know me and him would write the music but he was The Lyricist and he was incredible um but yeah a girl got between us and it was stupid and you know we didn't talk for the longest time then like uh I don't know maybe 15 years after we saw each other at a wedding and we were just laugh we were laughing how stupid it was you know and so neither of you got the girl and did you funny CU he was like the time he was like bro you saved me she's a crazy vegan now and everything you know so we always wondered like man what if we just like what was the name of your band it was Project Hill project Hill yeah so we uh there were some uh some places in Philly we played was um there were some some bigger places that was really fun to play at and it was and and it was fun but you know really doing that and that's your my my occupation was was working at the hospital but all of our money went into recording demos and putting songs out and trying to get a following we got put on the radio once um and just trying to make it and it's tough because just how the whole music scene like you fall into that party lifestyle and you can only go so far while living at home before your parents are like what's the deal man what what are we doing you know what I mean and they were very supportive and at some point when the band started to fall apart it was like okay well I'm 21 years old it's it's time to you know I gave this my best shot you know and really the only way that I feel people make it musically is if you don't have a backup plan and you put everything into go for it yeah but at some point it was like but that's a rest too because if you don't have somebody like your parents going okay dude like let's go yeah then you're yeah and at the time I'm starving like you know and there's no money at the time that we played we made enough money to pay for our parking you know like it wasn't there wasn't any money in the original music scene in Philly you know there were people that were playing cover bands you or cover music and and they were making a ton of money like it was you know like I like any time we would play I had a I had a black hooded sweatshirt that I wore that that said cover band suck you know they just go yeah that's where the money is that's that's where the money is at bar exactly yeah and we just never wanted to we never we wanted to do our own thing but at some point it was like all right it's time to so I sold out big time became a cop you know so you so you you wanted to do different genres and everything was there as kind of time went on was there someone like hey yeah I think I drum like this person or this is the best rock drummer I want to be like like anything so there's a guy named uh Mike poroy he's the drummer for Dream Theater um he was who he was the one that I studied the most probably I really uh mimicked my style after his you know but and it's and it's you know in Kine when I was in canine I know I'm jumping ahead but I was in K9 we have we contract with businesses and churches for their buildings for building and area search anytime there's a church with with the drum set I'm hitting it for sure you know I mean you know we got to get a drum set in here yeah we drum set think of up on the third floor hell yeah we'll put it we got extra space now Ashley did you have something oh I was going to ask if if you always in the back of your mind had an interest in law enforcement or not really no it's a good question and and and I did there's a little bit of a backstory to that as well um so my grandfather um he went into the Navy at 17 and then right from the Navy he went to the Marine Corps um and then when he got out um he was in law enforcement um I think he was an investigator for the um prosecutor's office in in Jersey and he did a lot of prisoner transport and stuff and um and he also raised German Shepherds um when my dad was growing up and so it's and it's you know as I was growing up I didn't know my grandfather very well um he passed away when I was in sixth or seventh grade and you know I always I wish that he knew where me and Jeff Clement who's my cousin where we ended up you know being in Kai and working with dogs he would have been so proud you know so I think that was a there was a little bit of a drive there that was kind of in my blood that there's there's law enforcement there but um what really kind of sold me that I could see myself doing that is um it's so funny cuz I talk about the program dare in schools right um and then end up being like the rock and roll scene like I put that to bed right I know I know drugs are bad but they're good they're awesome yeah I'm like why do kids use drugs uh cuz they're awesome they don't tell you that's hard find that out don't do drugs oh wait don't get caught yeah yeah there's always that yeah hey if it grows in the ground is probably safe Bo there it is yeah so uh the their officer um it's so funny how like you know people in your life in a young age can make an impact on you um his name was Richard Norcross um and he was my DARE officer and so in Haden Heights like I mentioned there's like seven officers in Haden Heights so I think when I was in fourth or fifth GR grade I think it was the same year that I was that I had dare um uh Rich Norcross and a US Marshall went to server a warrant on a guy that lived in Haden Heights I'm not too far from my house um I think his name was uh Leslie neelsen and he um yeah like the actor yeah Shirley you can't be serious don't call me Shirley I knew someone was going to pick up on that for sure yeah a hospital what is it so they they uh they make contact at the house Mom ANS the door they're like hey we have a a warrant for your son like okay he's upstairs and so they have zero training like down like down here you know I think it'd be handled different but they have zero training so they just walk in the house start walking upstairs fatal funnel upstairs and the suspect comes out through the landing with an AK and just opened up on um the Marshall and and Rich the Marshall was killed Rich was shot up um multiple times um blew off his his thumb to his right hand he was able to crawl out of the house screw him for help and they're like okay well four other officers are coming you know it's like and so Rich's brother John was one of the first ones to show up and as soon as he got out of the car he was hit in the head with the AK and it turned into a big uh SWAT call and like my school got released they didn't do really lockdowns then we got released I got sent home early you know get there's a shooter out there go yeah everyone run yeah and so uh I remember I was outside my dad was was like Hey so I think your DARE officer got shot today you know and uh I think I like the idea of law enforcement at a young age of uh having the opportunity to fight people who can't fight for themselves right so rich is he's out of the fight there's no way he can fight well then Camy County SWAT comes you know and they end up um and end up being barricaded subject he eventually gives up and he he either got the death penalty or he got life in prison one of the two in Jersey um I forget if Jersey has um the death penalty it got crazy after I left so they changed that I'm not sure but even at a young age that didn't like spark my interest like I'm going to be a cop but I think it it got the wheels turning there was a pilot flame there for sure yeah yeah yeah so uh and you mention so then what so you because you kind of jumped ahead a little bit earlier but so you were up there not going to be a rock star yeah died yeah here yeah so at the time uh my cousin Jeff Clement he's he works in the K9 unit now at the time um he was s and here here for penal yeah he he went to school in Kentucky and then he moved to penales and he was um one of the drill instructors for the boot camp when we used to have the boot camp um worked in the jail first and then transferred to the boot camp and he's phenomenal with kids and so that seemed like a really good calling for him but um at some point he transferred to the road but the time the um the sheriff's office in order to get promoted they had the Matrix system so you got certain points based on which units you have gone to so he kind of bounced around a little bit in anticipation in getting promoted and then that that Matrix system kind of went away um after I moved down here they started making some changes to the promotional process and so I called Jeff um my dad was very involved in that whole decision because you know I told Dad like hey I think I'm I think I'm done with this you know I mean I'm I'm definitely going to miss it it's in my blood playing playing music but it's not paying the bills and I can't live here you know much longer it's kind of starting to get embarrassing right and so uh and my dad knew that I had an interest in law enforcement spe specifically working with dogs I always thought the cans are just incredible you know um their abilities and what they could be trained to do and we always had dogs growing up and so I always had a passion for for dogs and so my dad was like you know Jeff loves where he works and when I lived in Jersey you vacation in Florida okay you know so I was like all right so I let me call Jeff and I didn't Jeff used to babysit me you know that's all you know but I didn't talk to him in so long and so my dad sent me his number and I called and I'm like it's kind of out of the blue man but I'm I'm thinking about coming down here maybe going to school maybe doing what you do and so he kind of set things up for me um he didn't try to discourage you no no he said he loved it down there down here and uh you know he's just uh you know ask me some of the roundabout questions about like all right can you can you pass this stuff like what have you done I'm like I'm you know I'm decent kid man I think I would do well here so um me and my dad flew down here and and I did a ride along and how that go who who' you ride with I rode with uh he doesn't work here anymore I think he got fired you don't have to name him then never mind what you what' you see on your first R fir so um it's very different from uh Jersey police you know so Jersey State Police is very different than FHP Jersey State Police are uh the best of the best at the time you couldn't get hired to be a Jersey state trooper unless you were six feet they had to change that at some point but um yeah but uh but they were um they were legit like you got pulled over by a State Trooper like Sur I'm going to die today you know it was that was those guys were terrifying yeah you know sheriffs do they even exist in New Jersey so they so they do the sheriff's office but all they do is the court system okay that's it yeah in the previous thing when you said SWAT came out where did the SWAT come from dur during that Cy County SWAT so the counties had their own SWAT teams yeah yeah Camy County uh had their own SWAT team and all the different counties so Cherry Hill Haden Heights all these little areas Haden field alline that was all part of Camden County um and the City of Camden um so but it was but it was a county function so it wasn't even under like the sheriff it was just yeah so so they would pull like from the different cities to create okay so but you know again people come here oh well Sheriff's Office and they might come from New York or Pennsylvania or New Jersey where sheriffs are not really there but then they also say oh well the state police it's like well you know FHP kind of only does traffic related stuff I didn't know that either right cuz you think about like in Massachusetts uh Pennsylvania state troopers Jersey state troopers those guys are legit you know they still are you know it's it's a it's a hard program to get through the how it's structured is so different from up North you know right so now Jeff obviously was working here did you always say I'm just going to go work where Jeff does or were you kind of open or what was the reputation of the Sheriff's Office like at the time uh so it was Jeff would always tell me like you don't mess with the star man everyone's afraid of star man you know uh he would say you know people most people go to the academy they get hired by other agencies it's just to get some experience and they transfer to the Sheriff's Office you know Sheriff's Office wasn't sponsoring them in the they sponsoring they weren hiring anyone no the only way you got hired was if you knew someone yeah and and that person had had a really good reputation to vouch for that person trying to get hired you knew someone I did I did I did even though it was just Jeff it was just yeah yeah and then in the academy it's funny cuz I listened to to Jan on the podcast BJ Lions was a big advocate for me to get hired as well cuz he taught me in the academy um a couple of things in the academy and so um so I was one of the few I think maybe there one or two guys in my Academy class that wore a suit for graduation everyone else is in uniform it's like Man and Jeff said like I got you man just trust me I got you it's like all right man I moved down here I don't have any job you know I live with Jeff's dad um while I moved down here while I was going to the academy um he passed pass away um I think in 2007 mhm but um so I you know I I graduate from the academy in 05 and um during that time I was kind of making some connections with um people that worked at the Sheriff's Office you know some my instructors um Mike killing was one of my instructors and then uh you you were in the in the like Vickers Tapia who else was there was was Taz there when you were there I did not have Taz no I had Jim Vickers Rick Tapia Randy corlette Mike kilan and um gosh I can't remember his name right now he's still I think he runs the academy right now he's the head of the academy but he was in there um but and it's funny because uh Mike Killian Randy corlette and Jim Vickers I all worked for a sergeant at some point you know and they're all my instructors you know um Mike Kean definitely the the longest but um but I I think from the academy and like my relationship with Randy corlette and Mike Killian um is really from the academy you know was the first first first that I really clung to and and got some information from and really um almost like an example you know um is that still the situation now at the Academy that some of our um trainers work in the academy there there's a few I'm not sure how many it's a separate gig right it is oh okay yeah they're hired bpsi by yeah by the college they're hired to to do but that's the same it was like that then too yes in okay yeah so the college so the academy is college accredited so if you go with 30 credits and you graduate The Academy come out with your Associates right I'm definitely getting ahead of myself on this but since you know I want to talk about the academy and how you did and because you have no law enforcement background nothing and the interest is there but now you know you fast forward now you're in training you're I considered you to be a a pretty uh squared away Deputy as far as training tactics you're out there training our next generation of of deputies like Y where did that come from what what did was it in was it and the reason I'm asking is was it because of your initial you know exposure to some of these folks in in training the Mike Kings they were like hey these guys are squared away it's really important or was there a situation where it clicked or or what's the deal there yeah you know I don't I don't really know where to credit it from I think a lot of it happened in the academy there's a lot of uh uh competition in the academy and I learned pretty early on like you don't want to be first in the academy you definitely don't want to be last just hang out in the middle you know kind of thing but uh like one of the guys I went to the academy with u Mike sper he's a lieutenant for Clear Water now um we're like brothers yeah we're really close but he um we became really close in the in the academy and uh you know we were always trying to like who's going to get the most push-ups you know Mike Mike beat me for sure you know but um but I definitely that's where I in the Academy I think that's where I I started I think it was it was an understanding of um I don't know how to fight and um but I knew that physical fitness is going to be Paramount for this you got to be good at it to signing up to solve problems and probably fight people and you have to be in better shape than they are and so you know there's definitely like like a farce fire that that started the Academy of like you know I'm I'm going to take this seriously and um so we're out of the academy and the academy was uh I enjoyed the whole uh the pressure on DT cuz you know like you know getting in trouble having to do x amount of push-ups like let's go you know like it's free workout every day but now were you were you into fitness and stuff before this I always worked out me and my dad worked out um really my entire adolescence and through high school we worked out together all the time was there any point at all in the academy or within maybe your first your early the infancy of your law enforcement career where you're like maybe this ain't it never never happened I think a lot of it is I moved away from home I went all in it was there was no there was no giving up like this is what you signed up for if it sucks suck it up and finish it you know you burn your bushes back New Jersey I didn't burn my KNE pal those things man like yeah gone yeah yeah just just for that clean break so you can focus yeah and so I that's one thing that I've learned about myself is when I commit to something man I'm a donkey I can't I can't be stopped you know and so you know and that's a that's a double-edged sword right right you um but yeah coming out of the academy um especially talking to like Rick Tapia um those guys who are so passionate about training and this is how you survive is is training and physical fitness like everything else you can learn but you have to have the the the mindset you know and you got have all the mindset in the world but if you haven't trained your body to you know react accordingly you know or you know it's just not going to work out so right out of the academy um before I even got hired like as soon as I gradu the academy um I went and joined uh Jiu-Jitsu gym under Eduardo del Lima's Gracie Baja jym in Clear Water wait when did you train when were you there I started in ' 06 so we must have met each other then is that when you were going Eduardo yeah yeah I was with Eduardo and Then followed the lineage up until recently so okay yeah so I I don't remember you yeah I started pictures I was 06 so his his what was it was it a 10 or 11 o'clock class in the mornings that's when I would always go um because I was waiting to get hired so I was going through the process and so I Val I was uh Mo Lawns while I was going to the academy and then I was Valley in cars at Island Way and Salt Rock Grill which was kind of awesome like lamborghin andent you're never going be able to drive the speed in a cop so doing Jersey state trooper yeah yeah you see those guys paychecks yeah yeah so I uh like valet and cars God there's got to be some stories there there's something there with Val and cars something about that yeah well it was a pretty good gig because they um you had to pay I forget how much you had to give back to the company but everything else was tips and so so really the more cars you violate the more money and I just hustle I come out the Academy I could run forever right so I was like I was making some money cars yeah yeah and so um I think when I went to Jiu-Jitsu and I met Jeff Katia before I even got hired the time he was a purple belt and uh just really impressed with him and he he had a lot of he was really good friends with um my cousin as well because they were in the boot camp together so Jeff had a lot Jeff ctia had a lot of um I owe a lot of of his kind of guidance but inspiration of being like man this kid can fight you know uh and so then I just I just decided that I'm all in on this as well the Sheriff's Office you mean the Sheriff's Office and uh and learn to fight learn yeah uh so you weren't sponsors you're in the academy you graduate the academy yep and then how long from when you graduated do you how does that go down when you get the call or reply or whatever it is yeah so I graduated in 05 and during that time I was coming into the it was the oldb then um and meeting with some of the um admin through Jeff um just kind of putting a face with a name and as soon as I got out of the Academy I started going through the application process and doing the whole background checks it's like Val um polygraph all that stuff cuz I was smoking cigarettes I was I don't know 16 or so and then Jeff was like well hey you got to quit smoking cigarettes I'm like okay done you know and so when I moved down here legit like quit smoking whatever was fine cold turkey cold cold turkey yeah it was again it was easy cuz I was so motivated I'm getting hired by this place you um yeah when I did my ride along the deputy like T someone I was like dude we don't have tasers in Jersey man this place is Gangster like a deputy got in a fight I'm sitting in the car like I have to move here you know it's like this is awesome that was awesome yeah yeah so then I went through the process and I got hired in March my swearing date was March 20th of6 okay yeah and uh who I hired with I got hired with Mike gell okay mik done some time in St Pete um and uh he was in my hiring class so how was fto was it so was it still structural like it is now there's some in-house with training which I always tout like not every agency does that like there's a there's some sort of In-House but it's not nearly as extensive as what we do here my in housee was was awesome because I had John Miller Randy corlette Mike hillian I mean just studs you know and so I I learned a lot in my in-house in my first phase fto um he was terminated also but I learned maybe it's you it could be yeah yeah like a Black Widow but I I learned everything how to be a cop from uh first phase fto he was a former Marine and his presence and his ability to control a scene immediately and I recognized that when he walked up to a scene it didn't matter what Dey was there who's taking the cover the complainant or the victim or the suspect would immediately turn and start talking to my fto he immediately controlled and I was like that's that's the staple right there that's how you have to be I learned a lot in through my fto time um and I got released from fto into North mids um which was easy but because I did fto there I knew the area and I knew where to go to hunt um but I didn't really I didn't really start start thriving in Patrol until I came down and I was assigned to 33 the Baskins car and me and Mike gatell were a two-man car and Mike gatell uh spent his time here narcotics but Mike was uh that's I learned how to work street level dope from Mike um just really good at identifying people and there's a um there's a file at Asis that he created that majority of the players and Baskins were built into and he knew them all by name they could shave their heads from when they had dreads and all shaved heads he knew exactly who they were he was incredible at it and so I learned everything from Gat as far as working street level dope and then he uh he transferred narcotics during that time and about 6 months or a year after that I transferred to uh K9 and backing up a little bit I I tried out for in K9 uh 2008 and at the time you had to be a deputy for 5 years before you could try out for K three years for SWAT and I made it on the SWAT team in three um after year three and then I made it in K9 after year five but I tried out in ' 08 at the time the sergeant Clark Wagner um he had seen my name in the guy's training logs because I would attach myself to uh Jim Vickers Tony lusso Nick fto right yeah oh yeah yeah I remember Dorne fto um my fto got a hold of uh Jim Vickers who I knew from the academy and said hey this kid I have wants to do K9 and you know I was catching uh Jim's dog toorn fto was just like I was hooked I was absolutely hooked like I have to do this and Vickers was the sergeant of no at the time he was just a deputy he was just Deputy then yeah yeah um but yeah so I it was one of those things where like a light bulb went off like this is the only reason I'm going to be a cop is because a k9 you know I was just like so really in the time when I was working midnights and once I got fto if a call came out was K9 related I was running with the K9 I just wanted to just saturate myself in everything about K9 just learn as much as I could and so because Clark Wagner had seen my name on some of the guys training logs um I put in memo to to try out and he was like I can guarantee you're not getting the spot you don't have your time on but if you want to come check it out and I did pretty well and so I now you know they knew what I was about and so I kind of got on their list if you would mhm was a try out uh similar to what you guys do now no the triy out now is it's so funny because like I listen to the podcast and they talk about like well crt's got the hardest swats got the hardest like it's a joke compared to K9 it's a princess it's Princess program seriously yeah it really is do three-way competition here yeah I haven't seen CRT trials but I've seen both SWAT and K9 and k9's k9's another level yeah so uh when we changed the try out the time for Kine um it was difficult but we we didn't have the we didn't really have the property um then to really kind of make it how we want to and um when we changed the tryy out um myself Tony laruso uh Jake Viano a couple other guys um and over time we developed it and added things and we made a monster of a trial and one that is not to Haze or um you know to prevent people from getting the unit but is things that we have taken from live tracks um things that you're probably going to see things you're going to have to be able to do and um while being tired and while be able to think clearly you know and people don't understand and I think even you know you know the guys that that that Ron the sherff I was I think that they you know there's a lack of understanding on what we do they know what canine does you have don't have a clue what we really do and what it takes to do this job you know and what what I love about uh pelis what I learned quickly um early on and definitely when I was in the keine unit is penel county is the tip of the spear on tracking we always have been we'll go to compet itions and you know we'll get beat in competitions by some of the top teams like Lakeland or or some of these other teams and they'll tell you like you can't beat us in competition but we can never track like you you know and so you know like real world tracking tracking yeah and everyone tracks a little bit differently like Pasco County they really put themselves on the on the map lately on on tracking um but we've always been great at tracking and you know I think the agency as a whole from you know from deputies all the way up to you know management I don't think they understand how spoiled they are with this K9 unit they're insane just how good they are you know cuz you just travel a lot go to different seminars you know you see that there are some agencies that still have a hard time tracking on pavement have a hard time you know they want area search and our guys are surgical on pavement you know it's just we always have been and so it there lot of Pride that how do you do that so um so when you're tracking you know what the what the dog is actually smelling is what they call skin rafts in dead skin cells that fall off the body and there's no way to control it it doesn't matter if you take on take off clothes put on clothes they're going to saturate their ways through the clothing and they're going to fall off and they they they will leave a trail that the dog can smell so our dogs are actually trailing dogs is what you call them they're not true tracking dogs a tracking dog is like sport where they're going go step for step footstep for footstep our dogs don't track like that they're going to Trail using the wind to their advantage um and so when they someone's running through a grassy area where there's vegetation those skin rafts will get caught up in the vegetation think of it as like confetti right so it's going to fall and get then get stuck in there well because there's there's these are microscopic there's no technology world that exists that can find human scent like a canine can and every person smells differently similar to fingerprints no two people smell the same yeah and so uh when those skin RS fall onto the pavement there's nothing to stop that for the wind taking it right if a car drives over that it's it's gone gone you know so now you have to figure out where that goes but if you have no granted if if someone tis off running at you know 300 p.m. at Home Depot and it's July there's people everywh like yeah you're probably not going to get a track right but 3 in the morning and the guy ran through the Home Depot parking lot our dog's going to find that guy you know I don't want to glaze over SWAT so you were you were part of SWAT first yeah I only did a little over two years on SWAT um I enjoyed my time on SWAT I was on the competition team uh for the Roundup um SWAT Roundup and uh and I enjoyed it and I had some really good guys on the team um Bobby cahun was my team leader I was on Charlie team I had Bobby cahun um Dave Danzig wasn't I'm sorry Greg Danzig wasn't uh a leader on the team yet but he was on my team and so I really looked up to Greg um Captain Jackson was on Charlie um I felt like every time we had an operation me and Melvin were always paired together um so I really enjoyed my time on Charlie Team U especially under Bobby and then I tried out for Kine during my time on SWAT where I knew I wasn't going to get it and then I was able to try out again in 2010 while I was on SWAT and and that's when I got it um and I had John Miller and SWAT was really difficult then really difficult um try out was difficult um but staying on the team was really hard um the training days were really hard there was 8 Hour training day and there was a 3-hour range day the 3-hour range days were so much harder than the 8 hour so I would come to work in my SWAT uniform I'd start at 3: I worked 3 to 11 in Baskins um and then SWAT training didn't start until 7 so my sergeant let me wear my SWAT uniform and then I'll just go to swat from 700 to 10 and just about every day after SWAT I'm in pretty good shape especially on SWAT you know I would on my way back to Baskins for my last hour I would pull over every time throw up it was insane how hard those three-hour range days the eventually went 8 Hour range St and those were like a walk in the park there was so much cuz there was so much more time they crammed so much PT and shooting and running and moving and just like it was a really difficult time to be on SWAT but because there wasn't a ton of work on swat at the time I was like you know what if I got the opportunity to go to K9 and as it as it turned out I got K9 2011 and I stayed on the team for a little bit during K9 school and I just I eventually came to understanding like I'm not willing to swear I don't want to share this experience with swad I'm going to get off you know so I had a good time and I made a lot of good Rel ships and I got uh all my training as far as uh tactically and and room clearing which benefits me now and well benefited my entire career for sure but uh being able to teach that now um in the training unit um so swad has really followed me my entire career but for me it really wasn't enough game time to justify standing on the team when Kine is Kine is SWAT every day yeah you know so yeah true story yeah um all right so K9 first dog how'd it go K9 school was tough um Jim vicer around my king9 school um and uh we never pted in king9 because Jim know I would call him out I know I could out PT him all day um and so we never did any PT but it was just you can't do anything right for 16 weeks you're just you just suck at everything right um and I hated my first dog absolutely hated him during Keen High School just because I just didn't know what I had you know really I think as a deputy when you look at the keang handlers you're like oh yeah work on a dog is easy you put a lead on them and you go find people it's that simple and there's a relationship that needss to be built with that dog there's got to be mutual trust with that dog there's there's a lot that goes into it and building that bond is very difficult and my dog uh I named him bosow um bosow he was an all black German Shepherd he he came from Poland um BOS would have nothing to do with anyone it wasn't just me he wouldn't do anything with anyone yeah I mean he got a toy he'd run to the furthest corner of the yard and lay down in the training field and you know the other instructors in Ken high school would be like get him to come back to you and I'd be dancing around call them on the ground he'd look at me like you're an idiot you know just had one nothing to do with me right and then just uh but he would do everything he was a great tracking dog he would do everything as far as bite work and building search and evidence recovery he would do everything he just wanted nothing to do with me and there was talk of getting rid of him getting rid of him really yeah just because he refused to build a bomb with anyone it's like he can't work a dog that doesn't you know can't listen to him and and there's a point in Keen high school and you're like is it the dog or is it the Handler right like is should the Handler just be better or does or is this dog a dud you know and it's hard to answer that question sometimes and so once what I started doing when I got home from K high school cuz just the stress of being yelled at for doing everything wrong like is really I found it very difficult to uh perform and do well and I've been through SWAT school and like getting screamed at isn't is whatever it's a thing but like really wanted to do well in Kine and I'm constantly being told that I suck at it like man I should have stayed in Baskins and stayed on SWAT this is like you know what I mean I had pretty good gig well everyone was being told they suck though right oh yeah it's still the same way I think it's I think it's a little bit more when I run when I run K9 schools I had the understanding of listen this school's going to be tough but if you're not having fun the dogs definitely aren't going to have fun and El whole falling apart so even though when I run K9 schools I'm very hard on them physically they're there's a lot of physical punishment but no one's going to scream at you or belittle you because the dogs got to have fun if you come out there stressed all the time the dogs aren't having fun the only reason the dogs want to be police dog is cu it's fun they don't know how dangerous the job is it's our job to protect them right and so I um so after K school at the time my wife was working and she didn't get up until 7 or 8:00 I would get home from K school at five and I would spend time in my backyard just doing food obedience with with bosow and so I ended up uh training a lot of Bosco Now Grant everyone showed me what it should look like so I knew when was wrong I knew when was right and within a few weeks um his obedience got really good and our bond just solidified and then like we were we were we were best friends then and when I got out of K high school we were Unstoppable for for 8 years we caught I think 213 people in 8 years uh he was an incredible dog I was very fortunate to have him because I learned everything about being a dog handler and that allowed me to teach other handlers based on what I learned from bos because he wasn't easy he was not easy I really had to work at it there's and I've been told there are guys who are just they're just very good at Kine just naturally Jake Fano I told was one of those guys just came from narcotics jumped into K9 and was phenomenal at it you know just you know whatever I really had to work hard at at K9 to be good at it but there's so much pride and so much uh you can see you can see the out the the output output of your work right so and BOS was not great on track on tracking on pavement and I just worked like crazy on pavement when I got out of K High School just non-stop I was just I was obsessed with getting him track on pavement our very first catch was through three parking lots all pavement my very first catch so it was like oh man I'm making this work was actually good that's a good point though I never thought of really because you know everybody trains right if you're deputy and Patrol you're training training all the time even kind of your example from SWAT like no game time yeah but canine is game time every day because you've been working with this dog on training and I know even if you guys are if you don't have calls nothing going on you're out there laying training tracks all the time so you're trying to make that progress but it's always been fascinating to me because well K9 was kind of one of the first places that I got hazed as a civilian by Mike yeah uh but you go out there and it's like can't imagine like my dog at home you know he's a German Shepherd but he's a [ __ ] yeah and I still we still look at each other I'm like what is wrong with you you know and but you know I still if I call him over to come he listens he sits he does all those things but that that's just to live this is not this is not my job you know so just to take a brand new person and a puppy that just came out of who knows where it's hard and now it's like okay it's really hard and I don't think uh I don't think people understand you get this dog that come from not only they come from another country country he was on like a kennel at another country and then he gets to a kennel in the states and then he's being like tested by multiple different agencies then he's finally picked and then he goes to the kennels at the Sheriff's Office yeah and then he goes lives with with a family and he's trying to figure out where doability they're pack animals they have to find out where they fit the pack you know that just takes a while you know but um there's so much pride in Keening and there's a lot of competition when I first got in it was Bob Li Bobby cahun um Kevin Andress Jim Vickers Nick bias Tony L Monsters of K9 and it was like man that's that is that's the level right that's the level to be at and I like to think that I completely surpassed all that you know I remember D King High School you know one of the times like CU it was hard at some point Jimmy and I started getting is a long School 16 weeks Point L there's no way I'm getting out here without killing this guy you know at some point I told him like I'm going to be better than you for sure at this and it's so funny like I can school and I my second dog I realized like he wasn't even that good I killed him in competitions I killed him in catches like he wasn't even that good so any any memorable sorry Jimmy no we're not sorry Jimmy not at all uh any uh any memorable catches anything with BOS is that you almost drowned with him yeah I did yeah we had a lot of close calls man yeah but one that was like very early on so I got out K school in May and in August of 01 um 01 Jesus in August 2011 I got um we again we were a little bit more uh lenient on Pursuits stolen car turned to Pursuit um their Deputy pitted the car they crashed at the intersection of uh McMullen Booth and Union Street where Union goes one way towards the school and Cedar goes in towards um l in Highlands yeah so I uh I get there and they say hey the the passenger bailed um we don't know where he went but the driver ran jumped this fence into the woods all right and so this fence had no crossbar right so they're really hard to jump because there's no stability in the fence and the top of the uh fence isn't curled over so it's all pointed like you're there's no easy way to do it we included that kind of fence in the tri out because there's no almost we're looking for ideas on how to do this better right but you just jump over it and you're going to get cut up it is what it is just throw yourself over so I get BOS over I get over the fence and I start going and the woods turns into a swamp I ended up being Knee Deep to waist deep eventually at some point I was chest deep at the time we didn't have the TCT vest all my equipment is on my belt and so my radio my gun everything's completely submerged and it's not the watery mud it's the mud that like every every step you're in like there's no way I'm getting my leg out of there it's like quicksand it's like what we all worried about as kids we thought there's going to be a lot of quick sand in our futures and there actually is that's the thing like you're supposed to grab an Anaconda from the tree and pull yourself out yeah well like so funnily enough right I was grabbing vegetation trying to pull me and it's coming right out of the ground and I think with all my stuff on at the time you know I think I was like maybe like 2:30 or something like that with all my stuff on so I'm just sinking can't get through and BOS was on the top of the mud barking and pulling trying to go like let me go and I remember in K high school you know Vickers had an incident where he got stuck in the mud and the suspect end up drowning during a fight but you know Jimmy said if you ever get stuck in the mud lean back on your dog and carage in the track and just gain some ground back so lean back on BOS BOS was a smaller German Shepherd it's all black you say lean back on him physically lean back on him yeah so with the lead so at the time with Bosco I tracked a 9ot leash and so just lean back on the line so you're pulling you're putting tension against him Hing the dog's going to pull against that tension you know and So eventually like I'm like this is not working like I'm like go see track and he's barking and pulling I'm like this is not working and real not realizing that I had been I came from my chest back to my waist I'm like oh [ __ ] so then I laid on the mud to disperse my weight and continue and I ventually got pulled out and I would low craw the rest of the track through the mud and then when I got out I was at a fence and BOS was trying to jump the fence I'm like hey man time time out could have died there yeah I was you couldn't reach your radio or anything right no at the time like 1024 is the I'm probably going to die if I don't get someone here and I was very close to call 1024 um but it wouldn't have matter my radio completely went out um I can't get to my gun my gun was completely kicked in mud I couldn't even find if I wanted to but I get over I get over the fence and I get a track uh in a school property that sets off a union and BOS alerts to one of the Portables and I look under there and there's this kid he's probably 110 lbs just terrified so he didn't sink when he no at all he ran right on top we actually joked about it later I was like bro did you sink in that he was like no I'm sinking what I'm like you got home like told my wife that one I'm always like can you stop going into swamps like you know but and to my backups credit like Patrol they don't they don't get it like this is what I signed up for to them I think it's nuts like I'm not doing that job but like hey man where they go we go it's just you know that's what I love about canine is you know is the whole idea like you know I grew up Christian I grew up in the church and there's a lot of time about uh canine that I would equate that to um there's a passage in the book of Isaiah it said like you know here am I send me right who's going to go chase these guys and who's going to go you know fight for this guy whoever and Grant the victim of a car that they got insurance whatever but and that's Petty right but there are sometimes true victims of crimes yeah where like who's going to go chase these guys into the unknown like put me in coach I got this guy right you know I mean I love that aspect of canine MH that's something thing I don't think people realize too like they they see that image of you guys with the dog and everybody loves dogs so they don't realize what you guys actually go through and like when I went through the March or the marsh with you guys and Tony laruso was talking to all of the guys trying out and was like this is what you're signing up for we're coming in here loud as can be you know they will see you before you see you know they will see before you see them and that is what you're signing up for do you know that does you know and I was like wow like that was so eye openening to me I was like that is not what I thought K9 was yeah and for sure and that's and that's one of the you know dur my time I know I I knew I wanted to be in K9 all through fto and all that but I think it was in um man forgive me I I want to say it was 2008 maybe 2007 when Matt Williams um and his dog dog were killed in P County it's the first law enforcement F I went to and you know I think some people might look at that scenario and be like I would never do kanang and I was like I have to do that job I have to yeah I mean that's but along those lines I mean not only going into the unknown but also going after the unknown yeah you know you got somebody that flees they bail out of the car you don't know what they got you don't know who they are you don't have the luxury that's and that's what is different about SWAT right because when SWAT does a warrant they know everything about these people they've been doing surveillance for months right they know exactly when they come and go who goes in the house what they do their complete background what criminal charges they have they know everything about these people M Kan I like where's my start point you have no idea if they're armed if they're not if they're scared if they're going to fight they have no idea you just trust that your dog's going to take care of you and that if you're lucky enough to have a backup that the backup squared away and hopefully you got some angels on your side to to get you through it and that's you just go you know there's no room for fear in Kine you know it's pretty wild yeah it is so bosow retires yeah I think he retired in 2018 okay and I went to test uh dog for my second dog and I had the idea I wanted name the dog Kaiser I want another I want a big all black Shepherd all right they're so cool looking you know I want another big black Shepherd so I go to the uh facility we test at which is uh Police Service Dogs in uh over in Okala Oxford Florida really um and so they bring out this big black Shepherd I'm like that's the guy and he failed every task we gave him like put that dog inside pretty couldn't perform I bring out this skinny Mal and he jumps up at me and like puts his head in my chest I'm like all right little fell you know males are generally really loving dogs until the wires connect they want to murder everyone you know but I was going to say the hell out of me yeah yeah they're very loving dogs and so like all right let's run this guy through it and he just Tas after test just killed it and so me and Tony were testing dogs at the same time Tony has Sor over me he's been the king9 unit a lot longer um and so um you know Tony walked out of track uh you know test Taco on tracking and M's are a little bit harder on tracking they like to leave their head up and area search a lot of the track they're easily distracted sometimes they take a lot of work on tracking and taco just had his nose down and went 30 Paces grabbed the toy like let's do that again and did it again and normally like you test all the dogs and there's a debate of Who Wants What dog and you talk about some yard rules yeah after the second track I sprinted Taco to my car and threw him in I was like this is my dog you know wow yeah and uh you know I think Tony initially was interested at Taco as well but when when he tested uh black and tan dog that is now Logan he was like oh that's my dog you know so I didn't take anything from Tony at all and looking back I had to do a lot of work to Taco with Taco to get him track where Logan was a plug-and-play dog you know I I I think I think afterwards Tony was like thank God I didn't take that mouth you know but I had to work really hard to get taco to be the tracking dog that he was which again goes back to my point of what you put in you will get out you know I worked really hard with taco and uh you know I was pretty cool looking back on this dog that jumped in my arms you know and then blew all the testing away and I'm like I have to work this dog and you know fast forward five years after I picked him he ends up saving my life you know so now before we get to that how did Kaiser become taco or was Kaiser only for the big black Shepherd if you got skinny little Mal named Kaiser you know what I mean there's no way he can't live up to it right little MTH like your daughter name Taco so I came home and uh you know I sent pictures to my wife like hey this is the new guy you know the skinny like little black mask and skinny little dog it can't be Kaiser I need some names I get home my daughter uh I think she was five at the time like I need some names and she's like Pizzeria I'm like that's stupid no else the got and she is she goes uh Taco Bell I'm like no she like taco I'm like oh [ __ ] man that might be that GNA work that might be good right yeah and so yeah and then you guys hijacked his name Tuesday I made a lot of money in overtime man because Ry Ryan Gordon would call me and be like hey uh hey can you come down do pictures like absolutely right there Tacos yeah so I mean my wife my whole family we have I mean we have no one calls them Taco we have a thousand different names for him you know but like what are that's how it is it's either talk tickers slippy Slappy slippy Slappy where where do you get where you get that Tik Tok I mean yeah there's I call only gets Taco when he gets it's like when you're yelling at your kid and use the full name and gets called Taco when he's being bad right that's funny tickers is probably the biggest one t was he one of the first full mouths that we had yeah that was kind of no so the first school that I ran um wife Whitehurst John har and Paul Martin was taking his second dog and I was told um do not pick any males there's this belief that the males are more aggressive or more violent than the Shepherds now granted like are Mals you know known for their fighting and then their aggression like a little bit I think just a little bit crazier you know German Shepherd is a little bit more mild mannered a little bit more uh let's be let's be honest males are stupid right and the wires connect and whatever they're holding on they're going to thrash and kill right um but again that goes down but they're fine but it goes back to the Handler right it goes back to the Handler the Handler is responsible for dog like so and to put it bluntly like we train our dogs to bite everyone they find we decide if the dog can bite or not right because we we can't let the dogs to they don't have the ability to think and use reason or logic to understand like can I bite this guy What charges do we have like but we have to train like if we didn't train the dogs to to to bite everyone they find he would have not reacted the way he did on March 12th right so and we go there and there was one German Shepherd that was decent that was Guinness that we bought for Paul and uh that Paul picked because he was he was a prior Handler and then there was two Mals you know I kind of fell into that category of these dogs are are scarier I didn't think they were you know but they I I mean I remember cuz everybody was like oh no they're fine but it would be like you know so I don't know if it was Taco but one of the other mes like I was stand he was just sitting there looking at me I'm like you are unpredictable right now stand there looking at you like yeah but again I'm I'm very hard on my dogs because I understand this this an animal that can make his own decision and if they choose to bite they can cause a lot of damage very quickly big small brain exact 100% that's a perfect way right so in order to make a Mal you you you combine a German shepherd and a raptor and that's a Mal right and so like uh oh this is the best dog that he has for the money we're going to spend and the way we train these dogs I don't care if it's a Shepherd or a m we're going to make him a good police dog yeah and to our point at work like John Harr is working Tyson and Tyson is I would argue one of the best dogs we've ever had he's a m you know so like again any major catches you're super proud of before we talk about March 12th like between BOS or or taco yeah I mean there's there there's a couple one that sticks out with with and it's a really long story I'm going to shorten it you know there Cliff Notes but um remember it was uh it was in January of 2013 it was freezing cold it was defin probably down in the 30s 20 mph wind no one's doing anything I was sitting at Mike's uh um St Mike's a and done eating MH just like waiting for the night to end so I just go home it's just freezing you know and when it's cold out you turn your heat on and you're trying to balance turn your heat on and not turn your heat alarm on but then then you're going to fall asleep with the heat on so it's like was trying to survive the night right and uh a call comes out for a home invasion and usually home invasions are nonsense like like the people in pel is kind of like like Five Guys in ski Mas AR to come break into your house and ask for the safe that's not a thing right that happens because you're dirty and you're slinging right and they know they know about you right no I'm sure that happens as random but they know something about you right so in this case um there's a lady in dun Eden and uh she described that she heard an explosion which was her front door being kicked in and before she could even sit up to see what it was someone jumped on top of her and was choking her was trying to kill her um and so this is the call that she' just been attacked and so I I get to the call and I'm like hopefully this guy don't see because there's no way we can track right because high winds it really defeat your track you know and so the Cole weather can sometimes help but the the high winds definitely there's no way we're tracking this guy when I got there uh true fear is on her face like she's wrapped in her comforter and her eyes are just massive and she can barely speak and I'm like you know and she's got marks all over her neck and stuff I'm like okay this is legit yeah this is legit and like the doors hanging off front door's hanging off I'm like where did he go and she pointed on the other side of the sidewalk like and she pointed like which direction he ran can barely speak and I was like I need you to go back inside and wait for the other deputies because I'm not waiting for a perimeter I have to go right now right and she was like I cannot go back in there and so her neighbor came outside and was like and I'm like hey do you know her like yeah like she just got attack and she stay in your house like yeah so she goes there I get BOS out and it's one of those like I'm finding this guy I'm I'm I'm going to hurt this guy when I find him you know know so I get BOS out and I'm like please get a track man come on and so if someone runs on the sidewalk um let's not go there I don't want to give any tips to to suspect right so I get a track good idea right should you go the sidewalk or should you not go on the sidewalk we'll never know don't run from the cops always that so I I get a track and BOS was a very fast tracking dog with full Sprint and as soon as I hit it I'm like you're done dude I got you once BOS was locked in It's A Wrap unless you get in a car I got you you know and so we track and I get to panel's Trail lose the track for a little bit trying to figure it out cuz panel's Trail is now a lot more pavement trying to work it I eventually get it going to a certain direction and as I'm tracking Lieutenant calls out and he like hey I got a subject running down the street wearing no shoes and t-shirt and boxers I'm like yeah I'm wearing like a beanie and gloves and two layers grab him right and so he he secures him I continue the track and as I come out to uh Douglas Haven Sunset Point um Doug yeah around Douglas hav that Sunset Point area um there's a business there done refrigeration and BOS turns and like launches himself in the bushes and I you know give him a attack command to like just kill this dude man go in BOS comes in and out there's no one there so it's a hot spot he was hiding there for sure right and so I shot my flashlight at the lieutenant I'm like where did you see him come at he's like right where you are I'm like that's him put him in a car and so they you know we through investigations or we figure out you know there there was a sweatshirt that Bosco found in the trash can door on the track the suspect's sister identified that was a he left uh he was wearing tonight like does it have a ho in the sleeve we check there's a hold sleeve like this is him and so you know he he goes to he goes to jail we put him in for uh burglary battery um so there's burglary battery of like punching someone through a down window which is a third degree felony there's burglary battery which is a first degree felony up to 25 years it's like uh who's trying to kill her you know and so um so the case agent ended up going for Narcotics and was really kind of absent of the whole investigation state attorney called me the ASA called me and he says uh so I got this case and uh my boss wants me to know file this because there's no evidence of him being in the house but how confident you are this is the guy I'm like this this is the guy I promise you my dog is surgical ATT tracking this is the guy and the sweatshirt ties him to this and that and so to the credit of the uh assistant State Attorney his name is Diego n he works for the US attorney now but uh he was like can I meet you out at the track and walk me through this track cuz I don't know anything about dog dog tracking or how they work and uh I walked him through the track and everything and just put it all together and he was like this is the guy I'm like 100% it is man dude I fight this man this is him and so we worked together to build this case against this guy um I testified once I spent about three hours on the stand mostly teaching the jury how dogs track you know and getting them understand there's no evidence at all that that led him into the house and um we got a guilty verdict he got 25 years um and then he threw up an appeal because there was a rapist in penel county that claudo dundo had caught with his dog right around the same time that my Victim was attacked and so the jury wasn't preview that information and so they threw up an appeal there's like a similar case that you have to notify the jury yeah it's called to reverse Williams Rule and that's what uh the appellant judge eventually said like well the juror should have been made aware of that so they did they did gave the guy a new trial I testified again to that and and this time they went through all of his property that hadn't gone hadn't been gone through before and they found pretty much a Manifesto of the suspect saying all the things he wanted to do when he broke into her house and no one had noticed that the first time noticed that nope no one had gone through it at all so uh yeah we put it all together so um so then they made a deal with uh the suspect that if he pleads guilty he'll get 25 years if he pleads not guilty and goes back they're ask for life and so then Co hit and a bunch of other stuff happened I believe he he's in prison but I don't think he's doing a life sentence I think they just you know they get just end up going down to plea Bargains and plea Bargains but either way uh that was one of those cases where I was like this is why I got into K9 fight for people who can't fight for themselves right you typically don't get to go through that entire process like that right this was so cool because you typically don't right you catch the guy and you just hope the best outcome and really a lot of credit goes to the the ASA who said I is this the guy I don't want to know follow this like just just done he was a younger attorney just like is this the guy man and we just we worked really well together and you know put a legit bad guy in jail and what's crazy is during the trial you know I'm like is this the guy that I screw up like you start doubting yourself and Diego when he was doing the suspect actually wanted to take the stand and Diego um had his his you know yellow notebook that he was writing in um you yellow you know paper pad whatever and he had is this your sweatshirt written on there with a big circle around it it's like it's Hail Mary if I feel like I'm losing I'm G to ask it yeah and so he threw it at him and the guy says yeah it's mine I I I I took it off and threw it at a trash can but that was that was months ago of course the jwy was like dude you're so full of it right and he also admitted to hiding in the bushes at Dy Refrigeration saying he had he had to pee but like the jury I think when the jury heard that plus with my testimony they were like It's a Rap dude you know and then but even still I'm like I mean the last thing I want to do is yeah you want to put the wrong guy and the guy had never been arrested before they didn't didn't have a parking ticket I'm like I mean am I wrong here and the second time we you know I testified fired and then they found that Manifesto like hell yeah BOS like so so you beening thinking about her for a while yeah so actually she was uh she was the manager of a pizza place in downtown dun Eden she was good friends with uh a girl that worked at um Catina in dun Eden um my Victim purchased the house and had like a housewarming party the girl in castina uh she was invited she brought her brother who ended up being my suspect and he developed this infatuation with uh my Victim wow and stalked her for a little bit one day decided to boot the door open and try to kill her and her testimony was that when the guy was choking her she she started uh she bit him and he had a big bite mark on his hand like how's this not nail on a coffin you know right but um but uh she's she thought I have to scratch him so they can find my DNA or his DNA on my fingernails cuz I'm going to die thought she was going to die yeah I'm going to die this is it and he was wearing a ski mask and uh they made eye contact and as soon as they made eye contact he freaked out jumped off a duck off running so was like I don't know who he is but he thinks I know who he is that's why he ran I think he probably thought she should have died sooner this is taking a lot longer and he panicked and took off running you know and so you know B bottom line is it's again like you said it's very rare that you follow the entire process and you see the good that you did now granted she that messed her up mentally for a while she she she she bought that house and a year later she sold it and she moved to another state um but I remember when I went to testify for the second time she showed up and I think what happened the third time she was like I'm done testifying I'm done every time she got to rehash it and all that you know but the second time that I testified um and I killed it again I knew the jury you know especially jurors love dogs and a good State Attorney is going to say like hey why'd you even BOS go like oh yeah he hangs out with her family and then J's like you know staring you like they love they look at the suspect like you son of know and so I knew so came up to me ball and Rise I give me a big hug like you saved my life I'm like oh my gosh like I love job you know what I mean like yeah for sure yeah because we figure I mean K9 you know like some of the other specialty units you don't I mean even even less so than Patrol that you know Patrol obviously get more involved depending on what it is or it goes iob or whatever but I mean you guys are really far removed so that is definitely a cool thing to be able to yeah and sometimes like sometimes detectives will say it's funny we'll sit at like like Kanan used to go to award ceremonies sometimes and you'll hear like berley will get the uh you know unit Achievement Award cuz they they sto like 30 burglaries whatever and they start telling the story and well around and we like Tony that was your catch Tony didn't get a thing you know you know but you know it is but again like can I we care less about the medals right we get 30 catches a year and we're super proud of our dog and we care less about about the medals you know so and Rel to the point like that's our job our job is to go in the placees the deputies don't want to go to so yeah you know that's enough for us that's good stuff yeah all right March 12th March 12th so um and I think um like I said I want to talk about really the aftermath and and I I think it's a really good picture of what folks have to deal with when they experience the sort of thing yeah so I'm just going to do just a quick and dirty and then we'll kind of keep it keep it simple on that instead of rehashing everything CU again we' we've been there done that but it does speak to kind of that that unknown that Tri going you know when I did the intro I said a re a routine track with a little bit of sarcasm because there is no routine you guys are going in there after the unknown uh call came out uh somebody committing vehicle burglaries in daylight which yeah it's daylight savings not not ideal uh and you you respond and uh Sergeant Viano was working Squad two this was down in squad one yes close yeah squad one I think it's unincorporate at penel Park yeah so for whatever reason Jake just says yep I'm going to go he he was uh you know k9 for a long time a lot of other things and I will say though your your video I thought it was really cool uh for the award we were talking about how you know you kind of Idol Jake andine at the time so it just so happens this just how it's going uh he decides to come run with you uh you guys really don't go that far into the track you go over a couple fences uh come around the corner and uh there he is you go down uh three shots and um you know Taco uh just grabs the guy and was definitely the you know you're you're definitely not here Jake's probably not here without Taco Taco holds him Jake fires uh takes care of business and um they got you ran the whole call got you taken care of got you out of there on your way to the hospital yeah um and it really it is really incredible um for our perspective I don't want to speak for everybody else but I think I'm from our perspective because we are out there talking about can9 talking about the things we do promoting training promoting all these things and this is truly one of those situations you can call it luck you can call it Divine Advent whatever you want everything's aligning perfectly yeah for you to still be here yep uh and for taco to do what you trained them to do you've sat here you've told us how committed you are to training and to making all this stuff happen and and now I didn't even really know the story about how Taco was picked so I mean that's even more like this this is why Taco is here so that you're still here so that Jake's still here yep so you have that whole thing you're shot in the wrist uh the thigh and then the neck the thigh is good to go yeah through and through I didn't know I got shot in the thigh until I think the it was I think it was a second day after the surgery you know from what I remember I might be completely we off cuz my wife still tells me stuff about the days in the hospital I'm like that happen you know theed is a hell of a drug you know but they like they went to like change my bandage on my leg I'm like I had no idea I got shot in the leg but it went through and through the meat didn't hit my bone or the artery um you know deputies didn't know that at the time they were completely right to put a herni on sure yeah yeah I had no idea I had zero complications with it like Lally put a Band-Aid on ballue right you know the neck was a was a tough one that was another one where you extremely forunate the neck still is a tough one you know so the round went under my left ear it passed through my neck I think when people hear I got shot in the neck they think of like a graze like no it went through and through my neck went through my left side came out my right side um the round was a hollow point it's a Hornady uh Home Defense hollow point and so it the round did its job to fragment and cause as much damage as possible so when it hit the it hits um C2 so a second vertebrae it fract it went through C2 that's when the bullet pretty much exploded uhh and most of it got stuck in the bone there's a 3mm piece that got stuck in the meat and the rest of it came out under my right ear so because the the bullet came out so much smaller than it went in I have a pretty decent scar on my left side but not really much on my right side um but it definitely it did some nerve damage in there you know that's still it doesn't ruin my day but every so often there's times like there it is you know and there's still pieces in there right there's still pieces in there yeah the ones are in the in the bone they're like we're never going to touch that it's way too dangerous we'll call it that's the best it's it's going to get the one that's it's 3 MIM that's stuck in my neck you know they've talked about taking that out and just saying you know because they can't do an MRI they don't know exactly where it's laying um you know I don't know it's not it's not awful you know I think if I do a lot of activity if I do like a shoulder day and I do a lot of traps it'll it'll bother me the next day but like nothing that I can't nothing worth going in there rooting around no and really be exploratory surgery right they could do a CAT scan and based on a CAT scan do measurements and go and grab it but um the fear is that it's somewhere near my my um occipital nerve MH and so the acal nerve uh starts on your head and goes down in your traps and all that so the bottom line is for me it's like you know I'd rather deal with the slight pain that I have than they start doing surgery and something happens that nerve and I lose the ability to use my right side in any way shape or form you know what I you know some and and the Pain's not so much that I can't say like some I feel it and I'm like whatever bro I'm still alive I still won you know what I mean so a lot of it is like a reminder of dude you're still alive act like it you know right and then the wrist yeah the wrist is uh it's and the wrist is really the worst one you know um the round went in the top of my wrist um and it it pretty much shattered the radius came out the bottom of my wrist um it severed the tendon that works my thumb they didn't think my thumb was going to work again um the surgeon uh his name is Christian mzac uh he's orthopedic surgeon he was incredible um the incisions he made not only saved my tattoo but that's the important part right but uh he put in like a 6 in titanium plate and I think there's 11 screws in there holding it together um and then he had to cut my tendon even more so he could microscopically surger you know put that back together and then when I got put in the cast he you know just started giving me exercises like I can't promise your thumb's going to work again but right you know just keep working at it and I just work my ass off in in uh physical therapy and occupational therapy in my thumb is back you know I can't feel it my I lost all feeling in my thumb but I have all the strength and so um so you can still win in thumb wrestling uh yeah probably I can't yeah if I if I couldn't see that I won I wouldn't know the difference but uh but no it still works and uh you know and during the recovery it was um there was a couple of U of like hard like mental setbacks recovery that I think is I think is important you know one is like you know because and all the told me like if you had not taken care of yourself physically no way you recover the way you did and how they explain it is like you know so your body has its own algorithm right and so if you are constantly like breaking down muscle fibers and building the mech up like your nerves are strengthening all these things are happening in inant in order you know produce muscle and and create all that so if you don't ever do that and you're injured your body is a slower process of recovering and and rebuilding those those muscle fibers and nerve endings all that because you have not taken care of yourself and it and it you know God forbid it to be you know a a shooting or a stabbing but a car accident right I mean the average person if you are not taking care of yourself it's too late right you didn't put the work in and so the body doesn't already know how to recover so exactly starting from scratch yeah and so like Physical Therapy was really difficult and you know I was in a neck brace for 3 months it was really hard and um but the doctors told me I need you to be on a uh if you can get a stationary bike or something just to get the blood moving get fresh blood the inured areas I can't been on Tre cuz I couldn't really walk that well um and uh so uh W Whitehurst and K9 he went to a CR he belonged to a CrossFit gym told his guy hey this is what I'm going through you know my my guy's going through he's a guy that got shot he's like give him more our stationary bike so had a stationary bike and so um i' watch tv TV while I was doing it but I really clung to uh you know I never went to the military um like I said like I was I was so involved in music that was the furest thing for me but with my grandfather like always idolized guys in the military and guys that give up you give up their you know their adolescence for you know greater good and serve the country and really risk damage through their you know mental and physical health and you know pursuit of something greater you know but um so I always had a lot of uh you know admiration for those guys but um I've uh Brad buers who I was on SWOT with and he was on um he was in keang with me he dropped off a book called perfectly wounded and that was written by Mike day who was sealed uh seal operator and Mike it's called perfectly wounded because Mike was shot uh 27 times um in one incident over in Afghanistan so they were you know hunting around doing you know high value targets and uh Mike's number one in the stack they do an explosive breach on door and he goes in and he's just hit with AK rounds from four insurgents inside the rest of the team can't come in Mike gets pushed back into a corner um he got shot 16 times in his chest plate and the rest were around his limbs of his body so Mike uh returns fire with his uh his handgun and he kills two guys two head shots and kills both guys the other two I realize he's still alive they start shooting him again but he has some decent cover depending on I don't know what this place look like but he has some decent cover but his hand gets shot and the round shatters the uh the grip to his uh six hour and so he has no more grip he rein searched a new magazine that now serves as his grip and he does two more head shots and kills the other two guys wow after being shot 27 times so he gets shot in the first chapter of the book you know and so it was one of these like man there's a lot to talk about there yeah and so I you know you know listen to the book and audel because I couldn't read I couldn't I couldn't bent my neck down you know but I read listen to the book and there's a lot of inspiring things of like you know find an excuse to win whatever it is and so I really got a lot of um encouragement from that book and then uh in April my dad knew I was reading the book and my dad did some research on Mike day and I got done the book I told my dad I got to he's not like uh one of these guys that goes into Government after the Seal team he's not a high guy like he's an average guy I got to find him on Facebook and see if I can talk to him just kind of let him know what I'm going through and make you know just offer some encouragement and he's like you know I didn't want to tell you but he uh he killed himself in April and I that's for some reason I still have a hard time thinking about that I think it it takes me back to when I was uh in that recovery and just like a little bit of fear like man he's a Seal Team like what's going to happen to me if if he couldn't take it you know um but at the same time it's one of those like you know Mike had a really bad childhood and he talks about that in his book there's a lot of demons he didn't deal with before he was shot um you have a really good support system 100% my parents are they just celebrate their 46th wedding anniversary you know they're incredible people I had incredible childhood I've never wanted for anything you know I mean so I have all the support in the world I mean besides my outside family the canine and know my wife is so much stronger than I am you know and so that is not me but it definitely brought a little bit of fear of like what is this road that I'm on you know where do I end up from here you know but um you know I just I just made the made the decision very similar to my decision of I'm going to keang and very similar to my decision of I'm going to move to Florida and get a 4.0 in college as a made a decision of like you know what this kid's in the ground collecting worms I'm alive and I'm going to beat this thing yeah you know what I mean I remember the first time I yeah I like that yeah the first time I jogged uh around the block with not wearing I drog with Taco around the block not wearing a neck brace or anything and I joged on the Block which was only about a quart mile I came back in the garage and I bled my eyes out like holy I'm going to win this thing I'm going to beat this thing yeah so it was very uh and Bobby cahun you know it's got to be said that guy was at my house every day take walks with me he walk Taco uh you know and there was the amount of support that you get and people don't know I mean there are a lot of units that I don't have any uh I've never dealt with the spot unit Robbery Homicide I've never dealt with those guys I don't even know half those guys yeah because they take credit for your catches exactly yeah yeah yeah any awards they have on their uniform K9 you know but the amount of support and the amount of donations the amount of publ cards and gift cards and food that was dropped off I mean it's insane to I mean to really talk about the family of law enforcement the brothers and sisters that we're the star and that we're the shield and in different municipalities logra SWAT Tampa SWAT panel pel's Park SWAT all the different can teams there US Marshals at the hospital MH I mean one of us goes down it's like everyone gathers together like this is this is why we gotten in this job you know what I mean so um so a lot of the my recovery is like like I'm going to number one I'm going to be better for me and my family but number two like I'm going be better for all those guys that came out to the hospital to support me and for Jake this whole thing is not going to be in vain he saved my life and my job is to live the best life I possibly can now that I'm giving a second chance you know and so and it's tough not being in I because that's my passion but um I am very eager looking at what the road is ahead you know but um yeah the recovery from something like this is uh it's difficult physically and mentally you know because it definitely changes you you know um and one of the things that was really difficult uh because my daughter was nine when this happened yeah it's not like she was two and you know she's not a she she's not aware she's done the wiser right at 9: you know my wife got the phone call from Justin feberg you know which is complete against policy like you know and studying for the sergeant test read how it's supposed to go and can is own family you know I mean and the thing is is like I and I have nothing against like from really all the administrators are considered to be friends um but like you know major Lazarus doesn't know my wife I don't want him calling you want your own to take care of own I want the canine guys cuz we're all family Justin John Claudio you know WTH all these guys I know their wives I know their kids Megan's friends with their wives like from Justin right you knowy goes out the window and that kind of stuff you know so absolutely so Justin called Megan was like hey no bu I just got shot you know and Ellie was in the room and at some point Ellie figured out that I got hurt and whatever so you know Ellie's in the hospital and with me and there's there's pictures of us I know you guys put up at the raay game like her and I walking on the hallway which was brutal but I wanted her to know like you ain't going to beat me man I'm strong like fine internally just like oh my gosh this ridiculous that was close yeah but she um yeah one of the one of the that was really tough how her little mind works is uh she goes to a private school in pelis and she came downstairs before bed and like I couldn't hug her for a bed she was kind of leaning to me you know I'm in a cast and I can't really do anything with my neck but she's like um we're learning about forgiveness in school and how do I forgive the guy that did this to you big things for a nine-year-old to be thinking about it's very unfair for kids to have to deal with adult problems right um and and it was just one of those like know baby we have to we have to give him just like Christ forgave us and you know hold we got the Ouija board you can send him a message there it is I mean holding on you stole you said I couldn't make a joke like that come on earlier yeah like holding on to that kind of anger that'll destroy you man you know in bottom line like I said before like he's in the ground he's gone yeah it worked itself out yeah yeah and so we have to move on there is life after this and we're going to be find but it's hard for a 9-year-old to understand those kind of things know but um but and and truth be told like um I'm very one one of the things I'm very proud of is I have forgiven Zion I have oh yeah yeah I mean the thing is is like I feel bad that he was lost look look at his upbringing look at his background I don't think he had if he did have someone to tell him this is not the right way to live like he didn't listen or maybe he didn't have anybody you know what's really frustrating for me is my wife is a uh like professional Facebook stalker she'll never post anything but she can find anything on anyone you know and she's been wom might be but she's been following uh Zion's mom and Zion's Idiot Friends most of them couple a few of them been killed after uh after the shooting and they were posting stuff about me and our threat and T guys went and hunted all those guys down uh one guy's probably going to be doing pretty good amount of time in prison one of the guys got killed in a shooting not really to law enforcement on s p like they're all idiots and Zion surrounded himself around idiots Zion was captured by one of our canine 6 months before me and him at really yeah I he got he got a straight attack so he knew what time it was he knew he was going to get bit you know but um but yeah so one of the things that really kind of infuriated me of I can forgive Zion for what he did right but my my wife had found on March 12 there's a memorial for for Zion I mean like four people showed up right but like his mom was one of them his mom was one of them yeah right his mom is there and one of his Idiot Friends is there in a picture lifting lifting up a shirt and showing off a gun and she's in the picture continues like like so you're supporting this this is why your son was killed the exact same stuff that's going on I think it's kind of hilarious like the guys that you know want to embrace this Thug Lifestyle and they go on Facebook and they show the guns they have like your posers man like I something I think about like like old school Mafia in New York City Facebook was a thing you think they'd be showing off tommy guns like no you're right professional right I and it's funny because like when I was working Baskins there was a there was a guy his name was marem Prim and markeem you who's a player he's a drug dealer and everything else but uh but when you caught him he was like most stuff you don't catch me for he caught me this time all right you know and he was like and he never you know never drove like a fancy car never thrat you know never flashed anything never flashed any guns he was a quiet professional criminal you know he was killed in in Greenwood a few years after I left Baskins you know but he was one of those guys that are very respectful he was like hey dude you have your job and I have mine I make more money than you do but whatever you caught me you know but like these guys out here that play this you know Thug Lifestyle it's it's a joke and they posers not true criminals you know I mean they're breaking into cars at midnight and taking off running again true think they're predators and how quickly they became prey you know and Zion you know thinking he was a predator when he when he shot me how quickly he was like oh man I I definitely bet off more than that can to when he's got you know 68 pound M hanging off of him and a stud like Jake Fano firing rounds at him you know he had no answer for that he had no answer for for taco or Jake like he fired six rounds and missed three of them and knew like well that's it for me you know and I don't think some people said this is a suicide by a cop I don't think so I think Zion was willing to kill anyone that was going to try to take him to prison he was facing a 5year sentence and he was he was writing checks you can't cash bottom line you know what I mean so but yeah so I'm but in in short to my daughter's question I have forgiven him you know because I want peace in in my life in my family's life and I know that's the you know that's the Christlike thing to do is to move on and in order to have any kind of happiness you have to you know move on and it's just poison right I mean that's just going to poison you and make you angry and so and move on and I'm hoping that through because Jake and I got invited to go teach at a couple big seminars this summer um just really a debrief um our hope is to really educate um handlers on the importance of training Ambush trainings and and not even just Ambush trainings on the Handler but like your backups you know right teaching people how to accompany you on a track and as K9 supervisor are you prepared what steps you have in place in case one of your guys go down right and so there's a lot to learn from this and we're going to take this awful situation and turn it around and offer some classes on you know yeah kind stuff and the Ambush stuff is is crazy obviously because of what you all face with the nature of what you do but there's a lot of conversations I think around law enforcement uh when it comes to when when law enforcement officers are encountering anybody y uh and you know well do they do they overreact do they this do they that and it's like well this is really one of those situations you know it's it's daytime yeah it is the most common crime in pelis County it is you guys have bags run from you all the time yep there's nothing abnormal about this yeah you don't come around the corner guns blazing no no and you you wouldn't normally unless you knew this person was armed or or whatever circumstances yeah so the one time that you're not ready yeah that same thing applies to people doing everyday stuff I mean this is the these are the things that law enforcement out they're facing and you you're seeing a situation with this particular family where and and I actually really I think it's remarkable the way you look at it yes um not the Forgiveness piece I kind of get that because it is a moot point yeah but but more so the fact that yeah I mean this is what he came up in this is what I came up in this is the environment he was in this is the environment I'm in you could have been that anybody could be in that position basically yeah two guys that weren't supposed to mean for sure right and it just I think it really speaks to the importance of training and and and answers a lot of it should answer a lot of wise for people as far as how law enforcement takes care of business sometimes yeah and I've had you know people that have watched the video um you know I try to avoid you know comments on most of our ours are super supportive you know and uh oh yeah definitely avoid the comments the dumbest people in the planet are on Facebook but like there's been there's been some questions even I think even from some deputies like man why would you just around the corner like that though because I'm a SWAT guy right a lot of the tactics you learn in Swat don't pass danger areas to get to danger areas around your corner if you do that on K9 tracks you're never G find anybody well but also go the pace of the dog you said earlier SWAT has plenty of time to stud on what on what they're going to do they know who they're coming up on right because the moment that you come around the corner and it's little old lady you know picking her daffodils or whatever bull that she has in her backyard then it's like oh it's police brutality because he came around the corner with a gun like yeah well and the thing is also like if I round in the corner at full length of lead right and I work Taco on on a 20ft lead um just based on how he tracks he tracks much better on a longer lead but if I had full extent again if you looked the video I had a shorter lead because I you know I hav miss meter right now we don't know if he broke in the car I lording prowling at best right so he ran I have a shorter length leas because if I round the corner and bite this guy oh gosh now I explain a spontaneous bite not that it's a big deal like whatever and then dogs are going to dogs be faster than you and Sheriff doesn't care about that kind of stuff as long as it's not a pattern you can fix it in training but but still like I know how to read my dog I know I'm close I can avoid up B I will right and so um you know I R in the corner expecting to see him running and if I saw him running I was going to release Taco at that point like we're done right and as soon as I around the corner he's already a shooting stance I'm like you know right and but like again I go back to you know you know Jiu-Jitsu on some you would think like how's Jiu-Jitsu playing this right definitely didn't help me you know get shot but understand that you know Jiu-Jitsu a lot of it is about mindfulness right for those five or six minutes in a round you are completely focused on one thing MH you know and it's like a chess match and so when I when I dropped in the backyard um I tried to set up right I tried to get up right away CU I was like he just shot me I'm going to kill this guy and but my arms wouldn't move and the doctor said you were paralyzed for sure just from the shock wave of the round not the round itself the shock wave paralyzed my spinal cord and I couldn't move and I'm like man I just got shot in the head and very Sim to jiujitsu but I was very calm like this is how it goes I guess and the black came out from the outside just to getting choked out and and was knocked out and I woke up CPR you know mean it was one of those like woke up CPR like freaking out of liit but like all right just breathe get it going and there's some similarities that that I wanted to point out there's some really kind of weird things that happen with the shooting um that I don't I haven't really told many people but I think it's I think they're kind of unique to to talk about so when I got put on the ambulance now like you know the tunnel vision started to open up a little bit more and realizing like okay so Amanda Edinger um she was in Kang at the time I taught her K High School uh really close friends with her and her husband um my daughter's friends with her daughter she gets in the ambulance with me and I hear the medic say he's pushing of 200 of fentanyl which is a lot of Fentanyl and I'm like I'm like Manda where did I get shot and she's like you got shot in the neck I'm like okay so yeah I'm like can you feel anything below the neck at this point can you feel I recall but I started I started moving my my feet like crazy cuz I've heard that people who are paralyzed they feel like they are moving but nothing's moving right and so moving my toes and I'm like are my toes moving she's like yeah they're moving I'm like all right and I started like freaking out a little bit right and so like yeah Manda was like I need you to look at me we're going to combat brief together I think I tried to FaceTime Megan my wife and Amanda's like do not call her right now and then the medic's holding the phone so I can FaceTime her and Amanda grabs it from him like what are you doing dude she doesn't need to see that yeah but um but I thought this is how I die for sure right and not knowing that none of my rounds are fatal I didn't know all the time but uh Amanda you know snatched my phone she's like I need you to look at me we're in a combat breath together you know and I felt like if I looked away from Amanda there'd be the reaper sitting right next to me and that would be it you know I think if I looked away from her I would have gone in the shock right and so uh during recovery um Amanda and Drew they would come by the house you know just like everyone else would you know but um Amanda sent me this uh this short little video on in Instagram like an encouragement video but it was a guy that just said you know you know keep keep going keep pushing forward today the day that yesterday you were afraid to facing but here you are killing it today it was one of those like I got this right so during Megan's um Facebook stalking Megan is my wife Megan saw she went on Zion's page the last thing that Zion posted before he was killed was today is the day that yesterday you were afraid of facing how crazy is that that's crazy yeah the other thing that's crazy about uh Zion Zion was released from prison March 12th of 2022 MH and we met and I got shot by him on March 12th of 2023 exactly a year after prison he's trying to kill two cops MH like like there was no help on this kid yeah I really think there's a point where God was like you're going to die today I've give you enough chances I'm snatching the life out of you today and Jake Van's going to do it you know what I mean so yeah that's insane yeah I I I I also think it's interesting the way you say that we met that day yeah it's very interesting yeah I have nothing else to say but I think it's interesting yeah well I think that's you know this is this wasn't by happen stance you know what I mean like this was written in my life you long before like you know I almost died before when I was four you know what I mean oh that's right drowning yeah yeah yeah drown when I was four my dad did CPR on me you know my dad still has a hard time talking about it you know but I mean but still like um I mean I want to get off this ride I'm done having CPR done on me can we be done my my uncle was at the hospital lot everyone I mean if you don't know Uncle Doug everyone in the agency knows Uncle Doug you you can call him Uncle Doug you know but uh but Uncle Doug was like man you're like a cat I'm like that I got seven more of these in me like I'm I'm done after two man I'll tell you what CPR hurts you have any were any ribs broken or your sternum cracked or anything that no the worst part honestly the worst part I like about getting shot was the tourniquets they're so painful I know yes we made we made Ricky hat put went on last we had had he put a tourniquet on my arm I'm like Jesus just take the damn thing off yeah they're so painful the arm off yeah take the arm off once they took them off I was undotted then also once they took them off I was like God they're brutal I mean that's how you know they're done right you know the guys that um that that came and helped me they they did it right you know um yeah so so you got to try fentanyl what did you think that wasn't so it's very shortl lasting but like yeah I can see why it's so addicting I would cook that in a spoon right now yeah no honestly when I got there was so much going on like I had fentanyl just for the ride and to credit to St Pete and panel's park and in the sheriff's office um for what I was told ambulance didn't stop once for any light at all they blocked off every intersection bay front and then I got to Bayfront I remember seeing a trauma team ready to go like when that when when that call goes out MH everyone stepped up to the plate I mean it's just crazy like you you know and the thing that is is is frustrating I've talked about this in the training you know I asked for this right between SWAT and canine you're you're asking to get into kind of these things but here's the deal you know the deputy does 25 years and takes a retirement and he works either days or nights whatever he works but he hides behind a building takes his calls he's the last one to get to the call on purpose that guy survives his entire career it's not what you signed up for right that is a violation of the oath that you talking with the sheriff and with the state of Florida and for the people of penel County right no I'll be the first I won't fight for people who can't fight for them right when someone calls 911 they should see a deputy who's squared away and ready to to take care of you you know anything less than that is it's a violation of your oath you know so whatever but you know what and there's there's cops like that all over the country you know who just they don't want to be first they want to take the paycheck and go home and do as least as possible luckily I think the majority of of deputies they want to do the right thing you know and they should be taking care of themselves and when someone calls 911 they should have a deputy walk up to them that looks squared away and then know that they're in good hands you know and so I take that o seriously but unfortunately it does come with some consequences right you know and is what is signed up for you know it is I mean the your whole background I mean everything you've ever done you just threw yourself into it and and got which is another reason that there should be no doubt that you could get through that because you just focus on it to get it done yeah and it's just so interesting to me because so many people in law enforcement that have been through different things they you know family of cops mil whatever yeah you know I I mean obviously your grandfather but I mean this was just you threw yourself into it and you're just going to be the best at it there is um one last thing about this I wanted to ask you about and and we can talk about anything else you want you know with the back end of it because law enforcement I mean there are obviously law enforcement officers that go through things that are equally as horrible they don't get they end up not getting shot they still have to work through it they still have to whatever but at some point you said something about your perception of yourself versus what other people see so you know I I am just impressed because you're the same MTH that I've always known for the most part maybe a little bit more insightful can have deeper conversation but you're the same guy you know you went through it and your power through which is you know you're doing well but you know you don't see yourself as kind of that Warrior as that hero piece because of because of it no I don't it's it's it's something that I struggle with you know um you know cuz part of me like um you know it might sound people might take this the wrong way but um I don't want someone else I don't want someone to save me you know and so even though I know there's nothing I could have done right right he saw me and heard me and I don't want to give him too much credit but tactically he did everything right he drew me into a fatal funnel and you know and I got caught and luckily he's as good of a shot he as criminal and you know didn't hit me fatally right but the problem is uh you know I feel like some of this is I shoulder some of this because I ran right into a gunfight you know somebody joke around with like taco like CU Megan would be like he's so sweet I'm like he walked me right into a gunfight you know but but no I don't see it and it's and it's hard because you know I um you I work out here during during my lunch and between classes and stuff and you know and I got to do a better job of people will ask me like details about stuff and sometimes I just could be like dude I'm just not I don't want to revisit I got to do a better job of that but you know I think people just want to sympathize and they want to you know hear and I think they're impressed that I'm already working out this and that but like it was really tough uh you were doing your job yeah that's what I signed up for you know what I mean and I got caught and so there's a little bit of you know my pride was hurt a little bit you know I mean this this kid who has zero training you know took me out of my game and so was you know my prob was HT a little bit but um I don't see myself as you know this Warrior or hero and and so it was hard because people would write these letters and cards from all over the country and people would give donations be like you're the baddest Deputy we have like this and that like d I'm not that guy man you know like I train my dog well and I want to do my job well and it's just I'm not that guy you know and um you know I don't know I think that there's and was a little frustrating is like so many people were coming to my house and they're dropping off food and dropping off money and dropping off cards they want to do the right thing it's ni is anyone going to Jake Jake's the hero in all this you know what I mean like and Jake I mean Jake when I was in the hospital and the whole keny unit came in it was after I had my cat scaned and they knew like he's going to to have surgery and this and that and I'm on deloted and just like flying whatever but I knew like Taco's dead I knew it you know and so whole K in there I'm like all right guys where's my dog s me with it whatever and they're like he's at the vet he tried to bite the vet just get kicked out like like Jake took a hostage shot and killed a guy right and then he quarterbacked the entire scene like I don't think people were going to Jake's house as much as they were going to mine you know and again like everyone knows like he's got a long road we want to make sure his family's taken care of and I get that and that's amazing Jake is the warrior right Jake is the in this whole scene you know and so again like I'm very proud of myself for the recovery that I've made I'm very proud of myself for keeping my uh um trying to keep my mind strong and maintaining that mental strength that I've been gifted um but it is hard uh people give me something that I don't I don't say not deserve but I just feel like this is the job dude right this is the job you know what I mean like I sign I signed up for it you know and and I feel like I did it well but it's uh I don't want that credit right you know I mean it's just more as a reminder of and I and I struggle with a little bit on training like if I just slown down if i' slown down like would I been able to get a shot um the problem is that is um that is a dark road to go down yeah you can't yourself the bottom line is like and I learned when I started thinking that a little bit like I got to be careful how I talk to myself because that guy is dead and I am here so I I teach a debrief for this me and Jake do it and going to that's what dbf we're going to do in in the summer but there's a clip from this guy his name is Rudy Francisco you can find him on YouTube um I mean like anyone that hears this go to YouTube and type in Rudy Francisco complainers this guy is not a cop he's not a military guy he's a poet but he is um we have completely different political theories right we're we're we're so different from each other but I I I heard this guy and I watched this video when I was um in recovery because I sleep wasn't a thing you know I couldn't sleep wasn't so much pain I just sleep sitting up on a couch and I'd not often wake up to pain like and taking every medication possible to make me sleep you know like just just ridiculous you know um and there were a couple things like when I when I woke up in the backyard and I remember hearing Jake saying like the worst is over MD stay in the fight the worst is over you know and so when the like the the sun would start to come up after I've been up all night and be like the worse is over you know those those words like resonate with me with Jake but I watched this video um from Rudy Francisco on complainers and he talks about like you know you know tell me about your boss tell me about your traffic tell me about you know you know the promise you made yourself that you've been you know postponing and not completing right how blessed are we to have trag is so small that can fit on the tips of our tongue right and like you know he said you know you know whether the glass is half full or half empty there's water in the cup drink that and stop complaining right and one of the last things he said is you know the the human heart beats 4,000 times per hour with each beat each palpitation is a trophy and GRA with the words you are still alive act like it and so I still those words still hit me and every time I do the debrief and I watch that I'm like hell yeah dude like I'm still in I'm still very much in the fight yeah you know I mean and so I am uh I'm very blessed to still be here and um I think it's very important that I love that people try to give me that credit you know that and if that inspires them to maybe be better that inspires them like hey that's the mark like he took three bullets and he's out here working out that's great it's hard to be a symbol though it's hard and I've always been very humble right I mean you know immersing yourself in martial arts and Jiu-Jitsu will do that to you and make you very humble um so I've always I've never thought of myself as you know you know someone extraordinary but going through some of the the readings and some of the videos and some of the uh recovery one of the things that I heard someone say is you know the Romans identified a hero as someone who uh has endorsed extraordinary things and then returns to teach those people those things and that's me and Jake's goal right now yeah is is to do that um is to discuss ideas of listen it's okay when you go through difficult trials in your life to ask for help you can't muscle through this stuff right it's okay to be in therapy for your family to be in therapy after there's trauma right because your brain can only take so much before it snaps and you might need help and that's okay I think feel like that's like a that's that's been a staple I feel like that's that's breaking a little bit uh especially in law enforcement because we've had way too many and Janna was talking about it and I know it's hard for hard for her to talk about there's so much support out there and and one of the things that I wish I was a little that I wish I could do over is I wish I was better better educated in the medicine than I was given okay because oh yeah you were on some strong things was on some strong things so like Terry Mets people don't know Terry Mets was shot I want to say 2003 2004 in penel county and he was shot with an AK in the arm shattered both bones he had multiple surgeries um and he was on very hard painkillers he eventually got very addicted to painkillers yeah and those painkillers they have the ability to rewrite how your brain perceives pain and to the point where I would argue Terry probably wasn't in pain anymore he just so addicted to Oxys that he could not get away from them anymore and and unfortunately end up killing himself so I was on painkillers really hard painkillers when I first got to the hospital after about two weeks I was like I done done with this I'd rather be in pain any chances they don't take any chances so I went to moin when the doctors thought I was crazy I'm going on moin because how do I want any habit forming things well the doctors put me on Lyrica which is a nerve pain medication and it's just as bad as oxy and all that it doesn't come with the same warnings though it does not and the doctors prescribe you what they know is going to help you but there's there's a lack of Education from physician to patient about I'm going to give you this this is really hard to get off of and this and that and so you know I struggle with a lot to get off some medications and I'm just about finished all my medications from March 12th I'm just about weaned off It's A Hard Road if I could do it all over like I would rather be in pain than be stuck on this medicine not doing it to keep my mind clear you know what I mean and so that's some of the things that I would uh it's one of the things that we want to teach when we do these uh these classes one like post tromatic stress disorder like that's a thing and it's it's okay it's a body's natural response it's what it's what you do to mitigate that and what how you surround yourself with positivity uh one of the things that my wife um you know she bought me a journal so and I got it from one of the deputies that that work here I got the idea from that one of dep that work here who's been involved in a lot of combat overseas write down the good days so when you have a bad day you can look back like oh I had a great day two days ago you know my wife bought me your journal and I started doing that and that helps with some of this also cuz the brain doesn't hang on to the good things as well you know the the rain smelled nice I had a nice cat your brain forgets those things the terrible things in your head and so that's the stuff that we want to teach is you know there is why you laugh the things I went to had a nice cat and I like the smell of the rain but no those are those are happy little moments couple drinks out and felt damn good okay okay we have different of I found out where the eels have sex I'm just hoping we make the Jour um but I think that that's important that people understand like there is life after uh trauma like this you don't have to stay in PTSD right so let's take a break from the work stuff as we kind of wind down here what do you do for fun certainly more things now that you have this yeah God unfortunately not you Jitsu iu- Jitsu so much yeah and so I doctor said no go on ever um no most of my friends had said please don't do that ever again it's just not worth it right I man I miss it so much I miss it just I think the mindfulness of it of just being so focused on one thing it's really a special thing when you can block out every problem you have outside of that gym and everything that's going on in work it really means nothing cuz someone's trying to kill you you know I mean within reason right you just tap it it starts over again trying to kill your friends good fun but it is uh there's something so therapeutic about Jiu-Jitsu now the guys that I go to I go to Gracie West Chase um and Joe bamboo isman is the owner there and and bamboo is constantly telling me just just come back and we'll we'll get you some light rolls you'll flow roll you only roll with black you know hows go though they they always turn serious like fighting with your brother before you know you're it's serious right and so I am not there yet I haven't completely blacked it out but I'm not there yet but outside of you know Jitsu I love working out my garage um my wife and I and my daughter we love traveling um we don't get to do enough of it um my wife and I got married in the keys um 2011 we try to go just about every year um I think this year we're going to try to take our daughter down there and do some of the water sports with her nice um yeah we just love the travel we're talking about next year renting an RV for about a month and just going out West Canyon take Taco with us also T so we definitely want to do do more traveling but honestly sometimes a good night a good night out for me is a good night in have moving nights with my family and just kind of everyone being on the couch it's sometimes you know and there's things about life and marriage and family where it's just like G you know but there's also times where it's like it's the best life ever man I'm still here to enjoy it you know I love I love girls so for fun I just man I love just taking care of myself and swimming in the pool with my daughter and hanging out in the back patio and just just being at home Taco Taco is enjoying retirement yeah yeah I violate every rule of owning owning a police G9 he sleeps in the bed he sleeps on the couch are there any rules after they retire not for me for BOS it was BOS was kind of like kind of Terror Taco Taco earned it I mean that was the you know I was I was off for a couple weeks but I came in for the award cery because I think it's super cool we gave a dog a medal of honor the first one isn't oh yeah hell yeah well deserved all loved it yeah that was awesome I thought it was very cool that the sheriff would would do that because the dogs are um they equipment they're not personel they have their they have a serial number right he has an asset number assigned to them yeah and so like when we retire and we removed that asset from the Sheriff's Office you know and so to give him uh an award and say like this dog is a hero and for this moment he's Personnel I was like man that's so cool dude that was in January I just got to a point where I knew knew I had to go back to work soon MH and physical I was ready to go and I already met met with the sheriff and was like I'm coming back January 16th I'm coming back to Kine and yeah I don't know what it was man I was still I was going I was coming off some medicines for sure so there was definitely a chemical imbalance there that was happening I was causing some stress but I was just like I this overwhelming feeling of I am done I'm done chasing bad guys I'm just done there's there's something else for me to do or catch bad guys but I'm done putting handout some people I've done 18 years between SWAT and Kine I've put in my time I'm done you know and I talk to the sheriff and luckily he threw you training right away he like you wanted a yours so it was kind of funny I don't know if you recall how I took it but he you know at the time we replacing a few dogs and he's like okay so it sounds like we got to buy one dog um how much are I'm like they 13 Grand right now and they buy him an Oxford and he's like okay um how old's the one dog we're we're going to give it to another Handler I'm like I think he's four and that's good he's like how old's taco and I'm like um 12 yeah uh sir I I would like to keep Taco he's like Oh no you're going to keep him I'm like Jee I mean like leave with that sir I'm like I'm like you need your SWAT in to get this dog back you know like I don't think you realized like how he said it I thought like are you going to try to give this talk to another Hammer number one like no one else could to work him he's so quick his tracking but I'm like bro we're about to fight you're stand up try to take this off from you know like but my wife and daughter they adore him you know my wife uh my daughter loves taco she takes care of him now feeding him and and she goes on walks every night with me he snuggles on the couch with everyone he's such a great dog which is such a cool thing about mes that that dog can snuggle on the couch laying on his back balls up in the air right just just loving life but then next day he can run into a gunfight and save his hand like the mes are just and really on Shepherds in general if trained correctly he's K9 are something very special they really are yeah all right well we like to give uh all of our guests if there's if there's something that we you could let the public know that would make your job easier we give you the opportunity yeah well I mean it's been it's been beat up but I'll say it again you know the gun that was used to shoot me was stolen out of a unlocked car Maran County I mean you know the person responsible for my injuries is Zion but listen the guy that left that car left the gun in his car he shoulder some of this yeah right I mean so every you have to lock your cars stop leaving your keys in your car stop leaving your guns in your car I mean listen leave your keys in your car and car gets stolen that's why you have insurance but your guns and your come on yeah it's just irresponsible and stupid I'm a I'm a constitutionalist I'm a big advocate of the Second Amendment but that comes with some responsibility right and the sheriff beats it up I think that the sheriff has done everything from you know Billboards to putting the pamphlets inside cars which you kind of crazy you know but like that didn't work either right people are obviously going to leave their cars unlocked they don't care some people get mad about there a brocher in their car they're going to do it either way but understand that the gun you leave in your car just because you want it in there in case you need it if you don't lock your car that gun could be used I mean there was just a kid that was killed in St Pete from a gun that found in an alley you have to be responsible for these guns because if you're an advocate of law enforcement that gun you left in the car there's no longer there that might be used to be kill to kill a cop yeah you know that a hard thing to recover from absolutely I don't know if that guy in Maran County ever found out that the gun his gun loaded with 13 Rounds of hollow points was used to try to K bu two deputies and a dog yeah dude that you know what I mean like you're not being responsible for the Second Amendment it's a it's not a privilege it's all right right but with that right comes resp responsibility thanks for coming on we really appreciate it I know you know we were all we were kind of hesitant to approach you because you've been overwhelmed by this the last year everyone makes you talk about this that's kind of why I want to do it because I wanted to give you a chance to show May I never here's the thing I never planned on doing it I happen to see a lot in the hallway and like like as you around the corner she sent me an email like there it is but here's the thing is the reason why I wanted to do is I want the agency to know and I want the public to know like I'm okay yeah I'm doing fine but understand that like this is a dangerous job but the people that put on the uniform they they accept those contingencies that they might not come home right really just bring an awareness that like listen cops are people man and sometimes this job is going to change them and so deputies who are having a hard time you know based where it could be anything it doesn't have to be a trauma it could be divorce or you know finances whatever the case is there is a silver lying and there is an end of that road it's just you know I come back to you know what helped me get through you know the physical injuries MH you know doesn't matter excuses stay in the fight right find a reason to win and then you know you'll be okay you know but that's why I really want to do the podcast is like if I can survive this and come out on the end and still be a good husband and good father and and try my best to live up to you know to that you certainly can survive whatever stress you're going through right but it's also okay to ask for help you don't have to muscle through everything yourself you know what I mean so that's why I want to do the podcast is really just let people know like life is sometimes you don't have to battle it alone you know no we we appreciate that I think it's kind of interesting with my question at the beginning that you were like I want to know everything like about the brain cuz it's that's why you go get help because we don't know everything about how our brains process trauma and different things like that's why you go to a professional that can help you talk it through yeah it's important totally it is it's important y corpal mad AK and everybody thanks so much for coming on and now if people who ask you to tell just tell them listen to the podcast go to podcast thanks again Matt before we shut her down Laura you got to do your thing uh we appreciate having feedback on the podcast if there's anything you want us to talk about any guests you wanted us to have on there is an opportunity to contact us and that is via email you can email us at let's 56pcs onet.com that's l56 p PCS onet.com that excellent we also do have a dedicated Instagram 56 podcast on Instagram uh 56 podcast just spelled out F I F Ty s iix podcast I want to make sure I didn't spell six wrong what what do you think about doing a teaser for the uh episode to follow this one who's next think that would be wise who's next um if let's just say if people had to guess what would be a logical followup to uh to Matt Aken Taco who would they think t I thought about bringing Taco I wanted you to I wanted you to bring taco and I wanted you to bring drumsticks yeah but you disappointed me twice thanks going to C just going to hit the delete button as soon as you guys all right so uh Jake yes we got Jake next yes all right oh hide your wives hide your girlfriends we go all right we're done [Music]