Yeah, I was walking my dog and I come around the corner and they were screaming cuz she's like, you know, you need to move out of here. >> Yep. What's with you today is the reason we were called here was a report that you were outside and you were dealing drugs. >> She was not. >> On May 28th, 2023 in Wisconsin, officers responded to a neighbor's report of suspected drug dealing outside an apartment building. The subject, Jenny, was on active probation for possession of methamphetamine. That single fact is the legal fulcrum of this entire encounter. >> [clears throat] >> Yeah. >> Selling drugs outside the dog park. We don't want her here. We're not going to have it. >> Yeah. >> And um Yeah, it was a plastic bag with a white rock in it. Her aunt is in the hospital. She should not even be here. >> Are you Who Who are you? >> I just I live next door. I deal with them fighting and arguing all the time. I'm the one who called. >> Oh, okay. >> So, where is she living right now? >> She's in apartment 110. >> And she's visiting somebody in 110 in the apartment? >> No, she's in the hospital. She got it. >> All right. >> And she shouldn't be here but she's not here. >> And why shouldn't she be here? >> Because the owner's not supposed to be here. The home owner's not available. Well, that I'm going to take up with the office on Tuesday. So, that's >> So, that's kind of where where we run into a little bit of a hiccup. >> Right. That >> Okay. >> That I'm going to go to the office on Tuesday. >> home owner the aunt who's in the hospital? So, but we don't know if the aunt has given her permission to be in there. >> Yeah, but she's been in there longer than you're supposed to have company. >> Okay. >> But that I'm going to take up with the office but she's not going to be down here selling drugs. >> No. >> No, absolutely. >> That's a total other issue. That's what we're addressing right now. >> Yeah. >> That she's there. >> Well, I can definitely try and have a conversation with her about that. As far as making her leave, I can't do that. >> No, that'll be addressed. Actually, that'll be addressed on Tuesday when the home >> Awesome. >> gets back and I'll deal with that with them. >> Okay. The apartment number she's in? >> 110. >> 110? >> Yes. And I will take care of that. >> Perfect. >> Yeah, but her aunt is around the corner now. >> Okay. >> Go ahead. Do you know her name at all? >> No, I did not. >> Who's the homeowner? >> I don't know who that is. >> I think it's >> I think it's her daughter that lives here. Her daughter. >> Her mother that lives here, I guess. >> Do you know the name? >> Name? >> Um her mom's name is >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Hey. Hey. I'm an officer with the Pima County Police Department. I was trying to get your attention. I'd like to speak with you out here. >> You would have gotten my attention more if you had stood by the door. Like you're stupid out the door. >> Oh, that makes sense. >> I don't know why you're sitting there. >> What's your name? >> Jenny. >> Jenny >> This is Jenny. >> Jenny Oh, your mom Is it your mom that's in the hospital? >> Yeah, no, she's not in the hospital. >> Oh, she's not? >> No, she's at the nursing home. >> Okay. >> But I just came here to clean today. And they haven't been here for a few days. >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah, so I'm going to visit her in a little bit here. >> Got you. >> And how are you? >> How are you doing? >> I'm fine. >> Okay. >> I'm doing fine. >> Okay. Okay. >> And then I don't have a problem, but I have a Well, I just went outside and was letting my friend in. He's going to go with me and see my mom and some lady was talking to me. So I asked this lady her name and she >> All right. >> tell me that they don't live here. >> Okay. >> But earlier I talked to this lady this morning when I was here. Got here and was starting cleaning cuz I'm cleaning carpet and stuff for my mom before she comes back. >> Yeah. >> And she had just asked me questions about it, but she was being really nice. And she's being really rude tonight. You know, that's the same mom. >> Okay. Okay. >> Yeah, so I told my mom to report that he was yelling and screaming at me for no reason. >> Yeah, well, that's kind of why we're here to talk about that. >> Yeah, that Well, that was what the issue was. >> Okay. >> Yeah, okay. And now >> Who else is home? >> There's nobody here. No, this is my mom's home. Nobody else lives here but my mother. >> Yeah, who else is here right now? >> My friend Randall. >> Oh, okay. Randall. Randall. Um yeah, so what I'd like to kind of address the reason I'm here is a couple of things. Sounds like management hasn't located yet as far as you staying here long-term. >> been staying here long-term. >> Okay, well, I'm just telling you what I'm I'm being told. >> Yeah, I'm aware of it. >> Okay, so >> Mom's aware of it. >> Okay, yep. >> And we got a letter from her today. >> Oh, you did? >> Yeah, so they're doing she has an inspection on the 30th. >> On the 30th? >> Yeah, and I'm going to be here for that part. She will let me know by then. >> Okay. And is Randall >> for >> Oh, sure. >> She cuz she had the carpet needed to be cleaned. >> Randall Randall Is he living here too then with you or >> here either. >> Oh, he's just just visiting. >> I don't live here either. >> Okay. >> I just already said that to you about how many times now. >> Well, there's a difference there's a difference between >> here. I can stay here once in a while. I'm on my mom's power of attorney. >> There we go. >> That's what so the lady the management doesn't know this. >> Okay, and I was and I wasn't aware and so >> the management is aware of it. >> Okay. >> mom due to due to her going in the hospital she was going to put me on the lease because of power of attorney. >> Okay. >> So that we didn't have this issue. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> Got you. >> So that was where we were going to >> Any idea how long time frame of >> supposed to be for a week or something, but >> Okay, well, that's >> That's why I'm going to go there and find out today. >> Well, you can't today. >> Go I can't what? >> Well, you can't talk to management today. >> No, my mom. >> Oh, the mom. >> She's going to tell me how going to be there. >> Yeah, well, then >> I know they're going to be here on Tuesday on the 30th and I'll talk to them. >> Sounds good. >> I'm aware of all that, yeah. >> Okay, which hospital? >> She can Thursday. I know all about this. I have this these other people that are talking >> Totally negative on paper. >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah, we >> Sounds good. All right, so >> hearing on July 20th. >> On on paper for what? >> OWI and bail jumping possession of marijuana. >> Oh, okay. So a 963 offense. So the other Under Wisconsin Act codified at Wisconsin Statutes section 3 04 .073 officers may conduct warrantless searches of probationers when reasonable suspicion of a violation exists covering the probationers person and any location where the probationer maintains access and control regardless of who holds the lease. The neighbor provided a first-hand specific account a clear plastic bag a white crystalline rock dropped and quickly retrieved. Under Illinois versus Gates 1983 this satisfies the totality of circumstances test for reasonable suspicion. >> The topic that I'd like to address with you today is the reason we were called here was a report that you were outside and you were dealing drugs. >> It wasn't. That's a lie. >> Okay. >> That's a lie. >> Okay. >> outside and Fred Stafford from room 303 was up up with a cigarette and was talking to him. >> Okay. >> And Randall came walking up and he was talking to me and I said let's go let's go inside. >> Okay. >> not ready to go yet. He said okay. And this lady screams in here about doing a drug deal and I walked outside and said to her "Are you talking to me?" Excuse me are you talking to me? And bam short little bam. >> So you shouldn't have anything on you right now that's illegal? >> on me. >> Okay. Don't dig in your pockets. All right? Um have you heard of Act 79? >> No I know of >> Okay. So when you're on probation for an incident that's related to drugs an Act 79 search allows an officer to search you anytime there's reasonable reasonable suspicion. >> your person your apartment your >> It's not my apartment. >> It doesn't matter if it's yours you're you're in it. >> It's my mother's apartment. >> matter. >> Yes it does because she's not here. >> For an Act 79 it does not. >> Okay. So I need you at at point >> What are you guys are guys insane? I didn't do anything. Go ahead and get the cameras. I didn't I didn't sell no drugs. They're lying. >> I'm going to tell you once right now. I need you to listen to me. Okay? You are on probation. >> I understand, but this is ridiculous. >> Okay. Turn and face the wall. >> I'm not running. I'm not going to do anything. I don't have anything on me. >> Okay. Stop. >> Stop or you're going to be placed under arrest. I don't have anything on me. This is ridiculous. >> You're on probation. It's not ridiculous. >> Yeah, it is. >> Why are you tensing your arm up? Stay in the room, all right? We're just going to detain her for a moment. >> Stop it right now. >> Stop moving. >> I don't have anything on me, I said. >> Stop. Stop. Stop like you probably put on the handcuffs. Otherwise, they're going to hurt. >> I'm telling you I don't have anything. >> That's fine, but you're not You're being uncooperative. >> No, I'm not. You guys are just searching me around for no reason. >> No, we're trying to explain things to you, but you are refusing to listen. >> I'm not refusing. I said you could search me, ma'am. That's none of your business. >> Did she >> Yes, I did. I said I didn't have anything on me. >> So different than saying yes. Can can you stop moving? >> wall. We're not here to screw around, all right? >> Stop moving. >> Yes, because you keep >> Sure I'll try to help you. >> How long have you been clean, honey? >> For How long? Seven years. >> Seven Seven or 17? >> Seven. I've been in treatment. I relapsed. Okay, so >> You want me to switch with you? Where did you get that pocket? >> I don't know. It's pretty >> I can switch with you. >> I don't have anything on me. Oh my god. I don't have anything at all. Just >> for my keychain. >> Yeah, that's fine. Hey, um it's fine. Are you sure it's only been 7 days? You're Just the emotions just are kind of are up and down. >> I suffer anxiety and extreme paranoia. >> Okay. >> Can I see them off? >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Go ahead. >> You don't have anything in your bra, do you? >> No, I just got my period. No, and I'm serious. >> Yeah, that's fine. So, under 869 if we have reason to suspicion, we can search you. >> That's fine. >> And that is what we are doing. You're placing handcuffs because of some of the behavior. >> I understand, but that's the thing. I'm >> I You were not going to justify the behaviors. I'm just >> being hovered by these people who I mean, they're >> Do you have other places to stay so it's not That's not here so that you could open up on the bed? >> friends somewhere else. I can't stay here today. I'm staying today. Literally, I swear. >> Where else are you staying? >> My girlfriend's. >> In where? >> Superior. >> All right. You have a way to get there? >> My bike. >> You have a bicycle here? Okay. How about Randall? >> Randall has has a bike that he uses and I don't know. >> Okay. Is he using them today? >> He said no. No. No, he is not. I promise you he's not. He doesn't use. >> Okay. >> He doesn't even use. >> Did you get a return on him at all? >> No, we're going to look it up. >> He'll be in trouble. >> Sure. >> Thank you for calling. I encourage you to get in touch with the management. >> Oh, I am. >> And they'll hopefully be able to >> Yeah, I hear them all night. I don't listen to music on my headphones. >> Oh, yeah. Next door. >> That's like I can hear them over my music. I shouldn't be able to hear that. >> How long have they been like cuz she denies staying there. How long have they been staying there? >> I think it's been a month or more now. >> Yep. >> Yeah, over a month. >> Okay. >> You can't say. I can't even hear I have my headphones on and hear them coughing down there. >> The lady that we escorted out, was that the one that you saw? >> Yes. >> Did you all Oh, did you all see? >> I did cuz I was helping up front my friend water the dog. >> I was walking my dog when I came >> And I saw a drug bag with white white rock pop out of a bottle. >> Yeah, I was walking my dog and I come around the corner and they were screaming cuz she's like, you know, you need number 401. >> Yep. Um so, saw the the white rock and it's a clear plastic bag you said? How big was the rock? >> Um it was a rock or a bag. >> Pretty small, but big enough that you could see you know what it was. >> It was roughly around that size. >> Okay. And it was a white rock? >> Yes, that's what I saw. >> Did it look kind of crystalline kind of? >> Kind of, yes. >> Not powder? >> It didn't look like powder to me, no. But she ran and picked it up real quick. >> Yeah, so I went down and picked up the little quick. I didn't get >> Oh, it fell out of her pocket? >> Yep. >> I didn't see any of that. I just heard the argument when I came up. >> Okay. Who was she arguing with? >> Let's go back to the >> We're good. We're good. >> I was arguing with Kelly. >> Okay. >> Cuz she told her that we don't we don't want drugs around here. >> Yeah, right. >> screaming at us. >> There's plenty of that going >> Then she asked me, she's like, "Well, who is that girl?" I said, "Somebody who lives here." And she didn't like that comment either. >> Yeah. When she picked it up off the ground, did she put it back in her pocket? >> Yes. Yeah, she didn't have anything in her pocket when I talked to her. So, she probably set it inside or something, but what do you do, you know? So, um did you see anything worth noting at all or >> She threw a pick up bag. >> Yeah. >> That's about it. >> When Jenny pushed back, "It's my mother's apartment." She raised a legitimate Fourth Amendment intuition. Ordinarily, a warrant is required to enter a private residence, but probation is not ordinary status. In United States versus Knights 2001, the Supreme Court held that warrantless probation searches are constitutionally valid when reasonable suspicion exists. Jenny's presence and power of attorney over the apartment placed it squarely within act 79's reach. >> Got you. >> Aside from the them two going back and forth when she came back up and then sit there and be like, "You guys want to say anything to me?" >> Yeah, she wanted to try to fight too. >> You you mentioned that you were aware that they'd been staying here for one or two months. >> Yeah, at least. >> Since you're kind of a witness, you mind if I just got your name down? >> What for? >> Sweet. >> Perfect. >> I promise you wouldn't mind you guys. I don't have a problem. I don't have a history of lying to you guys either. >> Okay. >> Hey Brandon, did we get anything back on Randall? He's on paper. >> I think he's not. Not yet. I didn't do anything. I'm not >> Yeah, he's in the other he's in the apartment as well. What's he on paper for? He's on for first-degree murder and burglary. >> 34 and a half years ago. >> Yeah. >> 34 years ago. He doesn't do drugs. >> Sounds good. It was in 1980. So I've met him before and I know that that's true. It's been a long time. He's been out for like 10 years now. All right, well thank you. All right, bye. He used to live over He has like a garage sometimes that's right off of like 35th and Ash area. That's where I first met him. Does he still camp there? >> I don't know about that. >> Okay. So no nothing having to do with that. Right. >> All right. >> I'm sorry that this situation even happened to you guys. >> I'm sorry, too. >> I'm just I'm just irritated about when she browsed up. It's Like I said, Randall come inside of We'll just talk when we get in here. >> She's probably So me and Randall were just talking about this. I go, "She probably assumed that." And he's like, "I don't know. I couldn't see that." >> Were there was no exchange of a little baggie or anything? >> I swear to God and my kids, no, and my mother, I swear to God, no. I don't even do that. >> When was the last time you did When was the last time you used? >> sell. >> When was the last time you 7 days ago? >> Yeah, that I relapsed, but I am in treatment. >> did you use then? >> I'm in treatment. >> What did you use at that time? >> Okay, I haven't used since then. >> Okay. >> And I was in um >> Have you met Wessel? >> I don't think so. >> That's That's my older brother, but we don't get along. >> I'm going to say they're both I'm going to say I know you guys don't get along. I've I've dealt with Wessel. I've only dealt with you a couple of times, but that was years ago. And I know you both you guys have kind of struggled a little bit with substance abuse, and that's kind of the drug of choice. >> Yeah, okay. >> And so I didn't first mine drug of choice is not meth. >> Mhm. >> It's usually marijuana. >> Is there anything illegal in this apartment right now? >> No. >> Okay. Well, like my partner explained >> You know what I mean? That's why I came here to do I do not live here. I came here to clean this. Not my apartment. So >> I understand. However, you were inside of this and you were temporarily inside of this. Your presence under the act 79 search >> doesn't matter I'm inside of this. >> Do you understand what act 79 is? >> I do not even remember what it >> it does not So then why are you trying to tell us what it is? >> Because I don't live here. I was just leaving. >> Yeah, that's fine. He's explaining to you that it does not matter >> Well, I don't want to be searched. Do you know what I'm saying? >> We're going to go through the entire apartment. >> Are you kidding me? >> Okay. >> Do you guys have a search warrant or something? >> No, you don't. Then I don't mind a search warrant. Yes. I want a search warrant. >> We're doing it under act 79. >> I want to see what act 79 is then. I want to see what it gets said. >> That's fine. >> I want to see Randall, don't open the door. >> No, that's fine. We can just go to the jail for resist obstruct. >> Well, come on. Give me a break. >> Randall, open the door now. >> What? >> No, we're not. Don't open the door. >> Randall, open the door. Under my shoes. >> No, that doesn't matter. >> You guys think you know this? >> You're going to >> Seriously, if you don't start cooperating >> You guys think you don't see this? For the love of god. No, I didn't We aren't doing anything. >> No, you're under arrest. >> You guys think you don't >> Well, you're under arrest, so >> But I didn't do anything. >> Yes, you did. >> That's the people that lied. >> You were You're under arrest for resisting arrest. >> Kelsey, do you want me to transport her? I can >> I find my pocket. >> I'm I'm calling everything. >> You sure? >> Yeah. >> Yeah, I'm sure. >> Get him. She doesn't think she resisted obstruction because she was already in handcuffs. >> I see. Yeah, I got you in handcuffs. >> What's that? >> She doesn't think that she resisted obstruction because she was already in handcuffs. Yeah, I'll be there. >> All right. I don't think there's a whole lot else to do here. >> No, just >> You're good to transport. >> Yeah, that's it. You want me? >> Yeah. Thanks, Kelsey. >> You're welcome. >> When Jenny physically blocked the doorway, she crossed from protected speech into criminal conduct. Under Wisconsin statute section 946.41, knowingly obstructing an officer in lawful performance of duty is a class A misdemeanor up to 9 months incarceration. The use of soft empty hand control and handcuffs was consistent with Graham versus Connor, 1989. Force judged by objective reasonableness from the officer's perspective, given Jenny's active resistance and known drug history. Officer Dupee receives a C+. His legal authority was correctly identified and lawfully exercised. Force was proportionate. However, his explanation of Act 79 was too brief and delivered without visible de-escalation effort. A clearer, calmer explanation before physical contact may have prevented the obstruction entirely. Jenny receives a D. Her objections were constitutionally informed and legally wrong in this context. By blocking the doorway, she transformed a temporary search into a criminal arrest. Under established law, compliance is required in the moment. Legal challenges belong in court, not in a door frame. The neighbor receives a B. Her report was specific, articulable, and first-hand the legal standard Act 79 requires. The lesson here is precise probation as a conditional liberty. Act 79 is not a loophole. It is a legislated exception to the warrant requirement upheld by the Supreme Court designed specifically for situations like this one. For officers, legal authority must be communicated clearly. Brief, plain language explanation of the applicable statute before physical contact is not just good practice. It is a risk management. For citizens on probation, the time to contest a search is after compliance with an attorney in a courtroom, not at the door. Physical resistance converts a civil grievance into a criminal charge. Let us know if there is an interaction or legal topic you would like us to discuss in the comments below. Thank you for watching.