on June 7th 2019 the kiok cuk police department received a call reporting a man sleeping on a bench they interact with the Man Logan land and ask him to provide identification the incident was recorded by the officer's body camera what's going on man hey we took a call saying that you might be sleeping out here no I was laying down for a minute oh okay back oh okay looking at the sky okay you got your ID with you no okay what's your name man am I doing something illegal well we got called here for suspicious activity so I got an idea is that a misdemeanor or felony huh is that a misdemeanor or felony is that a misdemeanor or a felony well it could be a misdemeanor if you failure to identify yourself well unless I'm breaking a law I'm not going to okay so you're choosing to get arrested instead of just giving me your name I'm choosing to not break a law which I'm not doing am I breaking the law by not giving me your identification yes you are that's not the way it yes that's interference are you detaining me or am I free to go no you're being detained for what because we're investigating suspicious give me Reasonable articul Suspicion we got called here by a third party for an individual sleeping by the flag pole okay you're the only person here by the flag pole did did you see me sleeping no you just admitted to me that you were I wasn't I never said anything about sleeping I said I was laying on my back and I was looking at the sky okay is that illegal no but I we still got called here so we got to investigate it well you call him back and you tell him that I wasn't sleeping okay legally Logan's refusal to provide ID depends on whether there was Reasonable Suspicion of criminal activity under the Fourth Amendment individuals aren't required to show ID unless police have such suspicion in States with stop and identify laws officers can request ID if they reasonably suspect a crime the Supreme Court case heel V 6th Judicial District Court upheld these laws but only when Reasonable Suspicion exists in Logan's case if the police had no reasonable grounds to suspect a crime since he was just watching the sunrise he likely wasn't required to show ID Iowa also has no stop in ID law so are you going to give me your name or not okay stand up turn around rest is this really how it works yes that is how it works man a supervisor here okay hey release your hands for me dude release I'm going double locky so they don't tighten up you're here to investigate doesn't mean I have to ID this isn't a Terry stop I'm not breaking the law all right hey you want to take him to your car Y is this your stuff stuff I'm not answering any more questions I want an attorney okay go ahead take 360 Le be 95 the warrantless search of Logan's bag could violate the Fourth Amendment which protects against unreasonable searches police can only search someone after a lawful arrest or with probable cause the case Arizona V Gant Limited warrantless searches allowing them only if it's reasonable to believe the area contains evidence of the crime if Logan's arrest lacked probable cause the search of his bag was likely unconstitutional without a lawful reason for his arrest the search would violate his [Music] rights you get out of here what's that you going let me out of here no why what am I doing here what what am I doing here well I don't know think you're under arrest what's that why you violating my rights we're not yeah you are no what's your name pal why why would I tell you maybe if you had if you had a a legal lawful reason to detain me I give it to you well we took a complaint on you so there was you can take a complaint on anything right so we have to investigate and that includ getting your identification obliged to entertain you absolutely not well you can talk to the judge about it then okay well this this ain't a communist country is it I I agree well then what the hell's going on well we're trying to figure that out well I won't figure it out well I would it like my right we're not you are no you are no we not you are you show up because you get a complaint of sleeping in the park right I'm not they show up and asking if I'm sleeping so you you tell me that that that that's a lawful detainment that's a reasonable articulable suspicion huh to to check on you absolutely to check on me for what to make sure you're okay don't [ __ ] me I'm not you're violating my rights it's it's an illegal detainment okay you can you can identify yourself to the judge or else they're probably not going to let you out though okay cooperate what cooperate with what well they have to know who you are before they have to know because talking to you okay would you are you going to tell me your name no no no you you tell me I want to know who I'm talking to you tell me how he lawfully detained me hear it right we got to complaint on you what's that we got to complaint on you all right it's suspicious because you normally yes it's suspicious behavior is that a misdemeanor a felony huh tell me tell me that tell me what code that is suspicious Behavior what's that is that are you familiar with Terry very versus oh I'm very familiar with you have to have a reasonable absolutely okay well then articulate to me about what crime you saw me committing you had a phone call you don't have to see a crime being committed to stop somebody and cheat you get a phone call well Terry V Ohio is a landmark Supreme Court case that established the principle of stop and frisk in this case the Court ruled that police officers can stop and frisk a person for weapons if they have a reasonable suspicion that the person may be involved in criminal activity and may be armed this SE known as a Terry stop does not require a warrant or probable cause but must be based on specific and articulable facts that justify the officer's concern for safety in comparison to Logan's situation for a Terry stop to apply the officers must have had specific reasons to suspect Logan was involved in criminal activity or posed a threat simply watching the sunrise doesn't typically meet this standard and if there was no clear suspicion of danger or or crime the reference to Terry may not be applicable to justify a stop search or arrest absolutely we tell a complaint yeah that's hearet okay that's not reasonable well it came from another officer who happens to walk the park and noticed that you're not there on a daily basis sleeping in the park and so I think it's probably pretty good grounds to understand why we're here okay an officer you think you know a lot here you're actually a lot you're not seeming to know a whole lot do know a lot here hold on I was that we also have a community caretaking function okay so again it's a little come on hold on again we have a community caretaking function here and it's a little odd when you find somebody sleeping so we can check on their well-being in the park as well is it illegal to sleep in the Park yeah Abol it's illegal to take a na in the park if you are there outside of ours absolutely am I there outside of ours you weren't when we found you however it is still oddd we can check on you it's odd it's odd it is odd must make it a crime [ __ ] well no this is some [ __ ] what was he arrested for gentleman interference okay interference interference is a crime of an illegal detainment it's not an illegal detainment sir you will not find any any concurrence with me on that okaye obviously do not know the law you don't know what a Terry stop is you don't you don't you need to go back to the academy I'll tell you that your supervisor who's your who's your boss the assistant chief of police can I speak to him cuz he'll see this is some dumb [ __ ] it's dumb [ __ ] I'm telling you you can be held personally liable you have no immunity when you violate my rights you're violating my rights well he'll be in in about an hour okay so I don't see how you don't see this he's the one who called on you it's an illegal detainment what it is it's really not sir it is it's not it is it is you you you are to me I already have several ways you're not seeming to comprehend you haven't you had you had people call in and say I was sleeping when they showed up was I sleeping I I wasn't there my officers arrest why don't you ask them it's Common Sense okay bud well you don't want to ask why won't you ask them they're right there interference he just didn't ID identify him simple as that that's crime bud that's a crime [ __ ] absolutely it's it's not a crime it's not a crime when some hey this is America this is America you must have forgot that if you I remember sir you you police in China Russia or some communist country you forgot what what the Yeah he can go the Constitution is just uh uh John Doe refused to give name just make a note y up on top [ __ ] arrest you guys must be really hard up we're really not you are no you are you're e at violating rights I guess the four the minute doesn't apply at all I just got to give you my name what else you want you said you'd give us your name if you love to go well I can't arrested me on some dumb [ __ ] I'm not obliged to give you my name I'm not obliged to give you well you can talk to the judge about that trip is what the [ __ ] it's really not it is not [ __ ] yes it is yes it is mug shot nope not well we need mug shots but dumb [ __ ] on June 6th 2021 Mr land filed a federal lawsuit against the city and officer Tanner Walden claiming violations of his rights under the Fourth Amendment on October 26th 2022 the judge ruled that Walden's contact with land should have ended when it became clear that land was not sleeping in the park or in need of assistance and that the city was not responsible for Walden's actions on November 22nd 2022 the city settled the lawsuit for $330,000 on September 24th 2023 officers from the Orange City Florida Police Department approached an individual standing by the roadside with a sign asking for financial assistance the interaction that followed was recorded on the officer's body cameras ma'am ma'am ma'am can you come over here okay what are we doing out here we can't with all due respect I'm not breaking any okay we're this is considered soliciting do you have a permit for it I don't have a permit and you need me to change a word I'll change it you what are you looking for money is that what you're asking for yeah I'm absolutely no you can go to jail for that you understand that in this city we have a city ordinance I I've already spoken with the police I've read the statute I get arrested there'll be for false Poli what police who did you speak with I've spoken with the sheriff you want to write me a ticket I don't want we're in Orange City we're not the sheriff understand but we're still in the State of Florida and the United States of America there's a constitution there is freedom of speech okay I understand that but federal laws trunk all other laws on all other levels well Forin I'm exercising Free Speech I'm advising the public about no you're seeking to get money you're seeking to get money okay this is this is not a place to get money you need to move along and get out of here no you can't you can write me a ticket you can't arrest yes I can we have a city orange then yes I can arrest you for it no you can write me a ticket if you want you can look up the city orange for City Orange City yes you can does Orange City want to go down for arresting a victim of domestic violence this is a public you need help I can give you some paper some paperwork or something every I've been listen I went to every agency it's just on the other side you just can't be out you can't be out here ma'am okayy I'm going to go over there when leave I'm coming back where are you going cuz if we get a call here for you again it's not going to be good okay I'm letting you know at this moment excuse me I said we get a call out here again to record this go ahead ma'am go ahead your State Police I'm war in City okay and if you want to if you want super me the or I'll get you the or I need it right now if you want a supervisor I can I can get you one out there okay if you want a supervisor I'll get you one out there I want a supervisor I want you to tell me the statute give me one second okay 10 are you reading channel one are you from here I'm not going to answer any questions [Applause] you call call Michael Chitwood he knows Chanel you're reading channel one and Michael Chitwood has uh more Authority than your chief of police okay in Orange City not going to put the SIM card in Bravo 10 are you reading Channel One go ahead hey are you near Harley TR Enterprise do you arrest Girl Scouts I'm sorry land I could he you I'm sorry do you arrest Girl Scouts are you near Harley stri enter I've seen them all over the place or your drug dealers seen them over to that on the other side of I for a minute okay I might need you over here I'm leaving and I'm advising you do not follow me do not stalk me do not harass me understood I said no I'm on a public Corner okay okay if they need to just goad this isn't private property without a permit is not allowed in the city limits and I can send somebody else to you if you need them what What's the statute I copy never mind I have somebody else What's the statute okay we have a city ordinance in the what is the okay that's my point if you don't know Florida statute or the United States Constitution that's not my problem but it will be your problem if you continue to harass me the woman argues that the constitution protects her right to ask for money despite the city's ordinance the Supreme Court has repeatedly upheld that solicitation is a form of speech protected by the First Amendment for example in the 1980 case of shamberg V citizens for better environment the court recognized charitable appeals for funds as speech within First Amendment protections however the government can regulate such speech under certain conditions content-based laws which Target speech based on its message are generally considered unconstitutional unless narrowly tailored to serve a compelling State interest as outlined in Reed V town of Gilbert broad solicitation bans typically fall into this category making them presumptively unconstitutional when you let the drunks the drug addicts and the prostitutes sit all over the place and just because everybody knows who they are they don't have to fly aside the money even though they're housed and they have income big difference so what is the city ordinance I'm not going to ask again so what's this cuz she's out here she tring to arrest me I never say I was going to arrest you yes you did I said we have aity listen I'm done with you now I told you we have a city Poli officer that's going to lie to my face understood but you just want to harass someone nope I'm not here I asked you if you have a permit I asked you if you have a permit and you said no I told what do girl scouts get permits okay everybody El gets permits yes you can't be out here soliciting we have a city ordinance in place what is soliciting okay exactly what you're doing right now ma'am you're asking for donations you're asking for money that is soliciting if you do not have a permit you cannot do that if you have one you can show me then I'll let you do it you have a now I'm going to be watching all these other people that are everywhere asking for money and see if they get hassle okay that's completely fine as long as you leave that's completely fine leave yeah you you can't you can't do what you're doing that's what I'm trying to tell you okay signs down this is a public corner tell me I can't do this you can stand here but you can't solicit that's the issue you standing here is not the issue I can't I can't ask for donation no ma'am not without a permit not without a permit you can stand here all day but you cannot solicit that's the issue you understand I want to hear the city ordinance one more time please I can print it out for you okay tell what you want you go ahead and print off her she threatened her arrest and holding a sign telling the public why I'm why I'm standing there because supposedly I was soliciting F okay if you have a sign out and you're asking for any form of donations money of of any kind that is a form of solicitation okay in the city of Orange City there is a city ordinance that governs that from happen Okay I want to see it okay I can go print that for you okay so okay so we so he's he's working on that then okay but I'm telling you now it is an arrestable offense yes it is so if you arrestable versus ticket no we can arrest you why because it's actually a city ordinance miscer violation and you can be arrested for it we do not unless you go to the city hall and and obtain a permit which I was already told I wasn't going to be issued when I inquired into de Barry okay well you inquire de Barry go to De Barry and solicit don't do it in orang City what I'm saying is they suggested I get a permit they said you can get a permit for it you can apply for a permit but you'll never get it is what they said okay well I can't say that Barry told you that I'm going to tell you right now I am I was a victim and I'm a Survivor of DV I was attacked in our state's capital this past June you are dealing with someone who has been harassed by police now this is something Orange City wants to be known for ma'am it's been hard I'm on the street okay I have zero income understood I have no no food stamps no welfare no nothing I don't drink alcohol I don't do drugs okay and I'm certainly not a hooker but I see those people all over the place and they're doing the same damn thing and when we see that we address know but you know what it's only me that happens to be seen you who called this in I don't know was it called in or did you roll on it sorry told me to come over here okay so who told you our supervisor our supervisor supervisor Sergeant Herzog Herzog that name you better tell Mr Herzog to back off and lay off because I dealt with the Herzog in Kingston New York probably a totally separate no it's not a that you know what you don't know more than I do I'm sorry okay now here's what I'm going to tell you because you're not going to dictate how this is going to work I'm just going to tell you that right now so you're going to grab your anything happens to this video and this is going this is streaming vide as well this is being backed up that's fine you can you're more than welcome to videotape I'm not telling you you can't your surgeon Herzog is going to get reported to the FBI okay that's great all I'm telling you is this me alone collect your things and go or you to jail no I'm not I'm going to stand right there in a public side right here there you go I'm going to stand right there yeah you go ahead stand but you can't be having any sign now you're telling me to collect my things and go if you're going to be soliciting you will collect your things and leave now you amended what you had to say you tell Sergeant harzard we're going to talk not a problem you you talk to him sign that is that asking people for fun listen so I if I omit the word if I omit the word donation difficult right now we have a being you are very much so this is a city ordinance violation this is law enforcement harassment you you cannot stand on a street corner and ask for funds or donations unless you have a permit to do so well I but what can I say that I'm homeless that I'm hungry that I have zero money okay I I'm sorry that that's a I'm asking you is that is that an option can I make that statement about what without without saying I'm seeking anything can Cann for money I never asked anyone I'm holding a sign I don't speak to anyone they're they're holding it outside their V tell you again if they're offering sign asking for offer unless you have a you know what we're trying to escalate this so you reason to arrest me no ma'am that's orange City's going on the map too I would hate the officers explained that under the City Rules people aren't allowed to ask for donations without a permit the rules required anyone wanting to ask for money to get approval from the city but only certain organizations could apply and they also needed insurance to cover any potential legal issues this type of rule which restricts speech before it happens is usually seen as unconstitutional unless the government has a strong reason for it courts have often ruled against such rules because they give too much control to the government without clear standards making it likely that a court would find the Orange City rule unconstitutional as well you're making it more difficult than it has to we're simply telling you our ordinance for the city and you're failing to adhere to that and with that I haven't failed to adhere to that you're going to stand out here and continue to ask to that you will be failing to adhere to that so I will tell you this again come back through here I'm going to make a new sign that doesn't say seeking donation and if somebody offers me something there is no law saying that I cannot accept it so when you want to arrest Girl Scouts and then all your people conduc illegal activity illegal activity then then you might have some CRS well and the people that are shoplifting listen I see it all I bet you do you seem like that type excuse me that sees it all you've got this tuition that you can you can read the future all I'm telling you is this the corner good job can't on the corner and ask for money or fund with signs it's called soliciting and it's I can say whatever I want on a sign continue to do it I promise you you'll go to jail better make in October 2023 after the video was shared Orange City stopped enforcing the unconstitutional ordinance by April 9th 2024 a new law removed the permit requirement and eased restrictions the updated ordinance now focuses on preventing disruptions to traffic flow rather than regulating speech content