Who are you and where do you live? None of your business. I choose not to tell you because I don't have to tell you who I am. Right, I live here. And you can prove that to me? Yes. Give your ID. Yes. Did I break the law? Well, I don't know that yet. That's the key. A resident inside his own HOA community was confronted by board members who believed he was violating fishing restrictions near a private pond. Although he repeatedly stated he was only practicing fly casting, police were called over possible trespassing concerns. Once officers arrived, the encounter shifted into a constitutional debate over the Fourth Amendment, reasonable suspicion, and whether police can demand identification without evidence of a crime. Okay, you should get So, there's a reason why I am not against fishing. >> I'm Don Kelly. I'm on the board. >> You're on the board, too. >> I am. Yes. How long have you lived here? Uh 8 years. 8 years? >> Yeah. Okay. I've lived here 16. Okay. Okay. So, why won't you just say that up front? >> I did. He did. But, who are you and where do you live? None of your business. >> live? It's none of your business. You're I know, but you don't have to tell me you didn't have to tell me. All right. I choose not to tell you because I don't have to tell you who I am. Do you see the signs that say no that say no fishing? I'm not fishing. He's got a hook on the rod. >> You want to look? Go ahead and look. Pull it. Grab the string. All right. So, you're just out So, why won't you just say this? I did. I did say this, but you guys wouldn't listen. It's called fly fishing practicing. I told him that from the very beginning. Okay? So, it's none of your business because I'm in my neighborhood where I belong and I pay as well as you. Correct. I'm in public. So, run for public office. Why don't you run for public office? See it. Quiet. >> Is that a board? The board the the the board's terrible. The board is terrible. >> I know. It doesn't matter. If the board doesn't matter, board doesn't too. No, go go ahead. Ask their might Matt Bicer. Have Matt Bicer come over, sergeant. He's in charge of everybody else. If he's on, tell him to come on over. None of them will come over. I've already talked to him about it. I already talked to him how you guys harass me continually when I come out here and do this and they laugh. >> don't even tell us who you are. Because it doesn't matter. I live in the neighborhood. >> want everybody walking up the road, coming here, ignoring the signs, fouling up the pond. >> No. I'm in I am I live in the neighborhood. Cost us I am not causing any fouling of anything. >> we know? It's none of your business. When we catch people fishing, we don't know whether they have something on What are you going to do to them? What are you going to do to them if you do? Huh? What are you going to do to them if they do catch somebody fishing? You're an HOA board. >> Yeah. It doesn't matter. >> There's reasons why we can't allow it. You can't allow it? Yes. Is it a law? It's it's an It's an insurance issue. >> It's an HOA issue. So, So, why did you call the police? Because you weren't telling us who you were and there are no fishing signs posted everywhere. Who Why would the police be involved in something that's not a police matter? Okay? Oh, great. Well, we'll go ahead and ask them when they come. And then we'll find out who's right and who's wrong. Okay? Okay, then go away. Then go Then go away. It's my private property that I pay for. That is not breaking any law whatsoever. And you called the police. What a waste of time and resources you did. All you had to do was walk away and say there's nothing I could do because I'm just an HOA board member and this guy isn't breaking any law. That's all you had to do. But, you didn't you had to harass me. Let me get Where's Matt Matt Bicer on today? Who? Matt Bicer. Lieutenant Bicer? >> Yeah. Uh no, he's I mean he's not on the night. >> He's not on tonight. Okay. You betcha. I'm going to record. Is that okay? Yeah. I'm recording as well. I'm Officer Fuller. What's this What's going on? They came up and harassed me while I was practicing my my fly casting. And which is a I think that isn't that against the law in Ohio to harass a somebody who's fishing fishing? Well, it depends. There is a sign that says no fishing, no trespassing. Okay. Comes down to where do you live? Right, I live here. And you can prove that to me? Yes. Give your ID. Yes. Did I break the law? Well, I don't know that yet. That's the key. So, you got to determine if I'm breaking a law before I give you my ID. What law have I broken? Right now, nothing. >> Okay, then I don't need to show you my ID, sir. Don't worry about it. I live here. So, you're you're covered. I'll show you my website, too, when you're done. Yeah, I'm good friends with the Matt. Matt's a buddy of mine. We do triathlons together. Yeah. David. I I'll keep my last name for the moment just because these guys want to make up some fine against me. You got to see the video. They're They were threatening me with fines that they don't even exist yet. I told them I wasn't practicing. Here, look Look at Look at It's not Yeah, I can't give it to you cuz I haven't done anything wrong and you you know, that's basically IDing myself and then they're threatening me with fines and stuff. It's nothing against you. That's why I said Matt Bicer got him on the phone. I'd be glad to talk to him. But, I understand he's off, so that's okay. Right. I'm going to come up behind you and video also. There's nothing legal about throwing a line in the water. He's not even fishing. Second, he has no rights. He doesn't have to give me his ID. He hasn't broken a law. Anything between you two is civil at this point. So, if you want to take him to civil court, that's your right. If you want to take him to civil court, that's your right. I can't make him ID himself to him. If you want to look, there's nothing on him on the line. It says no fishing, no trespassing. He lives on up here in here. I've confirmed that. He's not catching fish. There's nothing illegal about throwing a line in the water. But, how do we know in trying to enforce our HOA rules, how do we know whether any point in time a someone is just practicing or if they're fishing? Did they ask him? I I tried I tried. He didn't I I answered that several times, sir. I told you I was practicing. I even pointed out the rod. Thank you very much. Just He's not I've confirmed I'm telling you he's not fishing. He's throwing a line. If he wants to do that, that's his right. If you want to have the HOA thing, that's all civil. That is up to you. But, I can't make him do anything at this point and I would just ask you to to let's walk away together so this can end civilly. I don't want to see this. And don't waste my time anymore. >> I'm not against fishing. I am It's a rule that we have to have the fountains from being fouled. Had he not lived and had he not lived in this neighborhood, then I possibly would have a crime, trespassing, but it's not. It's all civil. And all he could do is kick me off the land anyways. But, I can't even I can't do anything. I can't even make him ID himself to me. I told you it was a waste of time. >> Can you ID his address that so I know he lives here? It's none of your business. >> I have no crime unless I have no I've The only thing is even the fishing part, that's all civil. So, I for me to make him give me his name, date of birth, address, I'd have to have reasonable suspicion Reasonable articulable suspicion. that he is involved in criminal activity, which I don't. So, I can't make him do that. I do But, it's trespassing if he's not a resident. But, he is. But, how how can you know that? >> Because he told me his address and he in fact does know one of our residents. So, It helps to know people. I also know George Lang. Can you tell these These guys are harassing me? So, that we know. I'm not going to do that cuz I'm not going to violate my civil rights. And he's doing a good job. Have a great day, guys. Thanks. This encounter centered on the limits of police authority during a civil HOA dispute. The officer repeatedly acknowledged that no criminal activity had been established and that HOA rules alone did not justify detention or compelled identification. He also confirmed that without reasonable suspicion of a crime, the resident could not legally be forced to identify himself under Fourth Amendment protections.